Who will the next permanent Chelsea manager be?

[Mark Kelly]

7 minutes ago, xceleryx said:

I do think if Pochettino didn't have a Spurs history his name would be being pushed more for the job. Sure, he's not at the pinnacle of coaching in terms of success, but we're also a side that's quite some distance away from being at a level to genuinely compete anyway. The first port of call is to get into that position, and like it or not Pochettino has had success doing this. Not only that, but he's got a proven track record with developing younger sides, something that ties in perfectly with the direction we're taking. Throw in a proven quantity within the Premier League, and I honestly think he arguably one of the best fits for where we are right now - which I feel is important for us to not lose sight of when appointing our next manager. 

Would also be great banter if he was to actually end up here and win something. 

Not to mention he will bring a touch of the dark arts to our play which we rarely get involved in , possibly because of the way our games are refereed compared to everyone else's but it would be nice to be the exponent of cheap collective fouling on the halfway line instead of the victims of it . 

Every corner we face someone will fall over in the area and stop play .

Got a star player?  We'll take turns treading on your Achilles! 

[Bert19]

6 hours ago, east lower said:

If there was ever a ‘model’ written of how to dismantle a winning mentality, the new owners can show up their first year in charge and say ‘that’s the way to do it’.

Or alternatively, the way to dismantle it was to sign and keep the sort of genuine berks we've spent so much on over the 5 years before the new owners arrived.  Because to put all of our recent struggles down to them and not at least partly to the established poisonous dressing room culture we've seen over the last 5-6 years at Chelsea would be disingenuous.  

We've spent ages and fortunes signing bang average players with huge wage packets and even bigger egos.  We were always treading a thin line with them.  Tuchel performed a miracle in 2021 and that gave several (Jorginho, Kovacic, Christensen, Alonso, Azpi etc) a stay of execution that they largely didn't deserve.  And we've had to manage fools like Ziyech and Lukaku on top of that. 

We only have to look at some of the performances in Cup Finals over recent seasons (losses to poor Arsenal teams x2 and Leicester) and how many times we've gifted three points to teams that have been really struggling (Arsenal, Everton etc) to see which way we've been going for a long time.  We've been guilty of losing games by just turning up and expecting that to be enough for years now.

The "Winning Mentality" has been less and less present for ages.  This season has just amplified it. 

[east lower]

1 hour ago, Bert19 said:

Or alternatively, the way to dismantle it was to sign and keep the sort of genuine berks we've spent so much on over the 5 years before the new owners arrived.  Because to put all of our recent struggles down to them and not at least partly to the established poisonous dressing room culture we've seen over the last 5-6 years at Chelsea would be disingenuous.  

We've spent ages and fortunes signing bang average players with huge wage packets and even bigger egos.  We were always treading a thin line with them.  Tuchel performed a miracle in 2021 and that gave several (Jorginho, Kovacic, Christensen, Alonso, Azpi etc) a stay of execution that they largely didn't deserve.  And we've had to manage fools like Ziyech and Lukaku on top of that. 

We only have to look at some of the performances in Cup Finals over recent seasons (losses to poor Arsenal teams x2 and Leicester) and how many times we've gifted three points to teams that have been really struggling (Arsenal, Everton etc) to see which way we've been going for a long time.  We've been guilty of losing games by just turning up and expecting that to be enough for years now.

The "Winning Mentality" has been less and less present for ages.  This season has just amplified it. 

Even the ‘berks’ won things and kept us competitive, the infrastructure behind them, kept them on their toes or they were on their toes out of the door. In reality our dominance was ending as soon as Man City won their first Premier League title. 

This lot have taken away the lot and did it in six months. Do what City did, piece-by-piece in a structured and planned way. Pains me to say that, but they did it the right way and are reaping rewards now.

They have blitzed in, acted impulsively and ruined us and maybe for years to come, perhaps (and I sincerely hope I’m wrong with this next bit) beyond the next 10 seasons or we get a cohesive long-term plan established with spending and finance that can match the middle-eastern owned clubs domestically and abroad - as well as Real Madrid!

I have a theory about American owned football clubs and it doesn’t pan out well, that’s why my preferred option when we were FORCED to change was Jim Ratcliffe and his bid.

[thevelourfog]

3 hours ago, east lower said:

Even the ‘berks’ won things and kept us competitive, the infrastructure behind them, kept them on their toes or they were on their toes out of the door. In reality our dominance was ending as soon as Man City won their first Premier League title. 

Completey this. It really is this lot who have dismantled us. That we were increasingly a less dominant force is the inevitable conclusion of City's state ownership being legitimised. I don't say that as a criticism (although I do have issues with it that are part of a different discussion), just as a statement of fact. Every other PL team was reduced to cycles of boom/bust on once City had their title, absolutely no one can compete all the time with a club who can spend £200m on full backs every summer if one of those they already own has so much as a hair out of place. We all basically know City flouted every single rule going to achieve what they have over the last decade, and they only did that because they would not have won if they didn't. Our falling away is much more a function of that than anything else.

And, as you say, even with our place as a club always in the title mix dissipated, we still consistently won trophies. Including the biggest of them. Until very, very recently.

I wouldn't say it was "disingenuous" to be pointing to pre-Clearlake for the start of the end of a winning mentality/DNA. Because it's just plainly incorrect. These guys sacked* all the winners. They did it. And replaced them with losers. Just them.

*Edit- the wrong word, perhaps. They didn't sack them all. More created the circumstances for them leaving. 

Edited April 17, 2023 by thevelourfog

[martin1905]

Anyone doubting Nagelsmann should have a look at them now under Tuchel. I love the man and rate him very highly but he's had a disastrous start and they look like a completely different team.

I've been very vocal about wanting Nagelsmann and this has just reiterated it and for what its worth I've watched pretty much every minute of Bayern since Tuchel  went there and watched them extensively before.

[McCreadie]

2 hours ago, martin1905 said:

Anyone doubting Nagelsmann should have a look at them now under Tuchel. I love the man and rate him very highly but he's had a disastrous start and they look like a completely different team.

I've been very vocal about wanting Nagelsmann and this has just reiterated it and for what its worth I've watched pretty much every minute of Bayern since Tuchel  went there and watched them extensively before.

Didn't you want Enrique though? The real issue is not what TT can't do for Bayern, it is whether Naglesman can deliver the goods for us. I know relatively little about either of them, but maybe Nagelsman feels a bit more like us.

[martin1905]

34 minutes ago, McCreadie said:

Didn't you want Enrique though? The real issue is not what TT can't do for Bayern, it is whether Naglesman can deliver the goods for us. I know relatively little about either of them, but maybe Nagelsman feels a bit more like us.

I wanted Enrique months ago, when we should have acted and sacked Potter.

The minute Nagelsmann was available it became a no brainer for me.

I'd be happy with either though or Pochettino or pretty much anyone that half resembles a football manager. I do not think the job here is very difficult. I think we should be walking top 4 with the squad we have and be looking to challenge for the league in 2 or 3 years time. 

[Holymoly]

This appointment has got to be the most important decision the owners have made and I am concerned it seems to have come down to either/or, Nagelsmann or Enrique. I'm not sure either have the credentials to fix the mess we're in.

Nagelsmann is young, he caught the eye at Hoffenheim and Leipzig, neither of which are a big club. He was called up by Bayern and, inexplicably his fans would say, let go at an important point of the season. You don't normally think of Bayern as a trigger happy club, certainly mid-season, and it has to be said the games under Tuchel do seem to exhibit some alarming form. Is it possible he destabilised the squad in some way? If so, do we need that here? He's young, which could be good but on the other hand, at a club like Chelsea, that could also end up being very bad with some of the misplaced egos involved.

Enrique, it could be argued, has underperformed his entire career. Prior to managing Barcelona his win percentage at Roma and Celta was under 40%. At Barcelona he won the Champions League once with a squad of superstars. Similarly when manging Spain he was  less successful than Gareth Southgate. Knocked out by Morocco in the round of 16 at the World Cup and in the previous Euros he selected a squad of only 24 with no Madrid players at all suggesting his way of controlling the dressing room was by freezing certain players out. Chelsea needs a manager that can heal the wounds and build team spirit, I'm not sure Enrique is that man.

If not them then who? No idea, but we have certainly painted ourselves into a corner with the sacking of Tuchel and the appointment of Potter. I'm not sure this club can afford to make another bad decision. If we begin next season like we are ending this then relegation will be a genuine danger.

[xceleryx]

11 hours ago, Holymoly said:

This appointment has got to be the most important decision the owners have made and I am concerned it seems to have come down to either/or, Nagelsmann or Enrique. I'm not sure either have the credentials to fix the mess we're in.

Nagelsmann is young, he caught the eye at Hoffenheim and Leipzig, neither of which are a big club. He was called up by Bayern and, inexplicably his fans would say, let go at an important point of the season. You don't normally think of Bayern as a trigger happy club, certainly mid-season, and it has to be said the games under Tuchel do seem to exhibit some alarming form. Is it possible he destabilised the squad in some way? If so, do we need that here? He's young, which could be good but on the other hand, at a club like Chelsea, that could also end up being very bad with some of the misplaced egos involved.

Enrique, it could be argued, has underperformed his entire career. Prior to managing Barcelona his win percentage at Roma and Celta was under 40%. At Barcelona he won the Champions League once with a squad of superstars. Similarly when manging Spain he was  less successful than Gareth Southgate. Knocked out by Morocco in the round of 16 at the World Cup and in the previous Euros he selected a squad of only 24 with no Madrid players at all suggesting his way of controlling the dressing room was by freezing certain players out. Chelsea needs a manager that can heal the wounds and build team spirit, I'm not sure Enrique is that man.

If not them then who? No idea, but we have certainly painted ourselves into a corner with the sacking of Tuchel and the appointment of Potter. I'm not sure this club can afford to make another bad decision. If we begin next season like we are ending this then relegation will be a genuine danger.

This sums it up well really, and showcases just how there is no single bonafide stand out candidate. Doesn't matter who we appoint there's an asterisk of caution besides their name that may turn around and bite us in the backside. 

The more time goes on and looking at where we are as a team, what we need out of a manager for the sort of squad we've got - or likely to have on hand, the more I move towards Pochettino if we're after a proven option. He may not have the winning pedigree of some of the others but we're also quite some distance away from being in a competing position anyway. We need a manager that can work with younger players and build a tight nit unit, and that's something Pochettino has over the other candidates. 

Will be interesting through to see who else we're looking at, and if we're waiting on options who'll possibly be out of contract in the summer before making a final decision. 

[Holymoly]

5 hours ago, xceleryx said:

Doesn't matter who we appoint there's an asterisk of caution besides their name that may turn around and bite us in the backside. 

I think whoever eventually gets appointed needs to give their thanks to Frank. No manager could have come in and changed the direction of the squad in the same four games that Lampard has overseen. It is entirely likely that between the beginning of April and the end of the season even a manager such as Pep would have had difficulty in changing the ingrained mindset of the players and thus have tarnished his reputation before a ball is kicked next season. Far better that the new man comes in without that hangover and start from scratch in 2023/24. Frank had the job of getting the club to the end of the season, possibly quieting down the increasing hatred emanating from the stands, full stop.

[Bert19]

15 minutes ago, Holymoly said:

I think whoever eventually gets appointed needs to give their thanks to Frank. No manager could have come in and changed the direction of the squad in the same four games that Lampard has overseen. It is entirely likely that between the beginning of April and the end of the season even a manager such as Pep would have had difficulty in changing the ingrained mindset of the players and thus have tarnished his reputation before a ball is kicked next season. Far better that the new man comes in without that hangover and start from scratch in 2023/24. Frank had the job of getting the club to the end of the season, possibly quieting down the increasing hatred emanating from the stands, full stop.

I agree with most of this. I would however say that his job now is to shelve some of those that are clearly moving on and use the younger, newer lads more in the remaining games.  Decent minutes for Madueke, Badiashile, Mudryk, Wesley etc will provide more value than seeing players like Havertz and Pulisic stropping about doing nothing for the 100th time in the last 2 years.  

[Miguelito07]

Got a feeling its going to be Poch as the next manager

 

[ROTG]

41 minutes ago, Miguelito07 said:

Got a feeling its going to be Poch as the next manager

 

Whoever it is now is the best time to hit the reset button. 

[martin1905]

2 hours ago, ROTG said:

Whoever it is now is the best time to hit the reset button. 

Disagree. 

There is very little point in making another change. There is nothing to play for, the players are have all been pottered and the best thing now is to get to the end of the season then reset. Let them go on their holidays but have them back early, with the new man in charge and ready for a full pre season.

Giving a new manager the next 7 games, with the state we are in achieves nothing, it could do more harm than good.

I 100% believe that is already in place and will be announced almost as soon as the season ends, I'd expect within 48 hours of the Newcastle game.

[exiledblue]

3 hours ago, ROTG said:

Whoever it is now is the best time to hit the reset button. 

I dont agree, short of relegation no further harm can be done,  but whover it is should get the nod soon so they can assess what we have so he can say who he wants or doesnt want to stay

[McCreadie]

Nobody is going to want to start before the chance to implement a proper pre-season. All that would achieve would be beginning the new man’s reign with 7 mostly bad results… we would be calling for his head by mid May...

[chrisb]

If we “potter” about too long though all the best candidates may be gone….

 

I’ll get my coat.

[Bob Singleton]

From today's Daily Telegraph (paywalled for most)

Chelsea cut next manager shortlist with Luis Enrique no longer among favourites

By Matt Law, Football News Correspondent

6–7 minutes

---

Chelsea have not placed Luis Enrique among the leading candidates for the permanent head coach job as the club start to cut down their shortlist and prepare for a new round of talks.

Enrique flew to London two weeks ago for discussions with Chelsea but there are no further talks planned with the former Barcelona man, which could leave the path clear for Tottenham Hotspur to make their move.

Along with Sporting’s Ruben Amorim, Enrqiue is now rated as an outsider for the Chelsea post with initial contact thought to have been made with all the main contenders – including Julian Nagelsmann and Mauricio Pochettino.

Chelsea are expected to hold further talks with Nagelsmann, who was interviewed last week, and Pochettino, along with other coaches, with club sources still insistent there is not yet a favourite or single leading contender for the post.

Nagelsmann is believed to have impressed Chelsea during his interview but, despite outside sources and some players believing he is the most likely permanent successor to Graham Potter, insiders have rejected any notion that the German is emerging as the favourite yet.

Former Tottenham manager Pochettino was interviewed by Chelsea and impressed co-controlling owners Todd Boehly and Behdad Eghbali before they appointed Potter. He is still available, having been out of work since being sacked by Paris St-Germain.

As disclosed by Telegraph Sport, Tottenham have made moves to contact Enrique and it appears the north London club might have a clear run at him with Chelsea’s attention focused more vividly elsewhere.

Chairman Daniel Levy has previously expressed reservations over Enrique’s lack of Premier League experience, but the Spaniard has been highly recommended to Spurs and is on the club’s shortlist of candidates to permanently succeed Antonio Conte.

Despite their elimination from the Champions League, the Chelsea job is still rated as one of the most attractive in Europe, but Boehly and Eghbali know they cannot afford to get their next appointment wrong.

Boehly and Eghbali have already sacked Thomas Tuchel and Potter, and put Frank Lampard in caretaker charge until the end of the season, inside 12 months.

Silva: ‘We, as players, must also take responsibility’

But, following the Champions League defeat by Real Madrid, defender Thiago Silva warned: “Everybody talks too much about replacing managers. I think we, as players, must also take responsibility.

“We have had three managers this season, plus a fourth with Bruno where we failed to win. We have lost today and with Lampard, we have failed to win. Everybody is talking about the manager but we must look at what has been done wrong and try to change.

“I think the first step has been made; an incorrect step, but it has been made. We can’t be blaming the managers if we don’t take responsibility. It’s a hard period for the club, with a lot of indecision.

“Change of ownership, new players arriving – we had to increase the size of the changing room because it didn’t fit the size of the squad.

“A positive point is that there are amazing players in the squad, but on the other hand there are always players that are going to be unhappy. There is always going to be someone upset because not everyone can play. The manager can only pick 11 from a squad of 30-something – that’s tough.

“Some can’t make the squad, we signed eight in January, we need to stop and put a strategy in place otherwise next season we could make the same mistakes.”

Players facing 30 per cent pay cuts after cup exit 

Chelsea’s Champions League exit has left some players facing the prospect of pay cuts of up to 30 per cent, while others will not see their wages immediately hit by a failure to qualify for the competition should they stay at the club.

The Boehly-Clearlake Capital owners introduced a bonus system after buying Chelsea from Roman Abramovich, who only paid bonuses for winning trophies and did not include Champions League reduction clauses in contracts.

Having spent £600 million in the past two transfer windows, the move to insert Champions League clauses will help offset some of the costs of not playing in Europe’s top competition, although some of the cuts may be deferred past next season.

A number of players who joined Chelsea or who have signed new contracts since the takeover agreed to a variable salary scheme that saw a portion of their wages, as much as 30 per cent in some cases, tied to Champions League qualification.

But those still on contracts agreed under the Abramovich regime are guaranteed their full wages should they stay at the club this summer without signing new deals, despite Chelsea’s dismal season in which qualification for the Champions League has now become impossible.

Big earners from the Abramovich era include Kepa Arrizabalaga, Kai Havertz, Mateo Kovacic, Hakim Ziyech, Christian Pulisic and N’Golo Kante, who has been in negotiations over an extension to his contract past the end of this season.

It is expected that any of the players from the Abramovich era who sign new contracts at Chelsea in the future will have to agree to the Champions League clause, so that the reductions impact the entire squad when the full transition period between ownerships has come to an end.

Chelsea have signed 12 senior players on permanent contracts since the Boehly-Clearlake takeover, including January recruits Enzo Fernandez, Mykhaylo Mudryk, Benoit Badiashile, Noni Madueke, David Datro Fofana and Malo Gusto, who will not be available to play until next season. Silva, Reece James, Cesar Azpilicueta, Ben Chilwell, Trevoh Chalobah, Armando Broja and Marcus Betinelli have all signed new contracts since the change of ownership.

[thevelourfog]

Seen a few reports, seemingly coming from The Mirror originally, that Pochettino has basically got the job and has insisted Mount be kept, and be offered a deal he'll take. Idk that I put any weight on it, just sharing. 

[Mark Kelly]

Just now, thevelourfog said:

Seen a few reports, seemingly coming from The Mirror originally, that Pochettino has basically got the job and has insisted Mount be kept, and be offered a deal he'll take. Idk that I put any weight on it, just sharing. 

I'm warming to the idea of Poch as we kind of know what we are getting with him whereas Nagelsmann is a bit of an unknown quantity with a set way of playing that I honestly believe our players are too thick to get on board with .

Collective fouling , feigning injury , screaming when tackled , pretending you're hurt when you lose the ball , holding your head in the penalty box when a corner is being taken , these are all much easier to learn. 

[Miguelito07]

1 hour ago, thevelourfog said:

Seen a few reports, seemingly coming from The Mirror originally, that Pochettino has basically got the job and has insisted Mount be kept, and be offered a deal he'll take. Idk that I put any weight on it, just sharing. 

Take this with a pinch of salt - my mate who works in the same building (Knightsbridge) where they are holding the interviews has now seen Pochettino 4 times - the last of which, he was with his wife.

[paulw66]

The great thing for any new manager is going to be that we have no European football*

One game a week, with an entire midweek to work on shape, tactics, systems etc.

 

* appreciate we want to be in Europe, but from a coaching perspective, the situation is ideal (see Conte in 2016/17)

[boratsbrother]

11 minutes ago, paulw66 said:

The great thing for any new manager is going to be that we have no European football*

One game a week, with an entire midweek to work on shape, tactics, systems etc.

 

* appreciate we want to be in Europe, but from a coaching perspective, the situation is ideal (see Conte in 2016/17)

Yes, that factor is certainly one that's a help to the new manager. But with less games to play it  does make it even more important that we move on a significant number of players this summer. 

[ROTG]

20 hours ago, martin1905 said:

Disagree. 

There is very little point in making another change. There is nothing to play for, the players are have all been pottered and the best thing now is to get to the end of the season then reset. Let them go on their holidays but have them back early, with the new man in charge and ready for a full pre season.

Giving a new manager the next 7 games, with the state we are in achieves nothing, it could do more harm than good.

I 100% believe that is already in place and will be announced almost as soon as the season ends, I'd expect within 48 hours of the Newcastle game.

If the club waits until 01-Jun, then it a case of the new coach culling the squad  by 30-jun without having a chance to assess the players 

These remaining games are a free hit  
 

[My Blood Is Blue]

I am starting to lean towards Poch, to be honest. I was all in on Nagelsmann, however, having seen just how bad it's got for us, how lazy the players have become, I do think we need someone like Poch to come in and add a bit of discipline and proper worth ethic into this squad. I feel like where we are with our transition, which is essentially rooted at the very bottom, we need someone who knows the league and can come in and get the players playing for each other and for the club, someone that won't accept the kind of performances some of these players have been putting in.

His record of winning things isn't great, but right now, we should be more focussed on building the new foundations for this era and much like the Mourinho did for the Roman era, we need to get some nasty in there and a win at all costs mentality that can then start to run back through the club.