Chelsea_Matt Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 5 hours ago, ROTG said: I was a Crespo fan Can I borrow your tin hat 😀 Me too. Absolutely ADORED ol’ Hern. Class. 🇦🇷🩷🩶👀🧨💯 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chara Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 6 hours ago, ROTG said: I was a Crespo fan Can I borrow your tin hat 😀 I can't believe any real football fan could be anything but a Crespo fan, 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelsea_Matt Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 2 hours ago, boratsbrother said: Indeed! Just carrying on at our 2024 level we'll almost certainly finish 4th at worse. That is unless there's a significant improvement from a Villa, Spurs, Untied or Newcastle and I honestly don't see significant improvement in any of those teams. I expect Newcastle and Spurs to be the level they are now. Villa to fall back with Utd maybe overtaking one or two of those three but not enough to keep up with us. Sort our defence out and we'll seriously challenge Liverpool for third. 👀 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chara Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 With,hopefully, a full fit squad to choose from The Poch will come up with consistent game winning tactics but my (suspect) gut feeling is he doesn't have the "touch" or bravery to reach a different level despite the potential in a fully fit squad. The Poch has recorded "form" over a period of time and imho will present us with a Spuds slight upgrade...almost but not quite................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kelly Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 1 hour ago, Chelsea_Matt said: Me too. Absolutely ADORED ol’ Hern. Class. 🇦🇷🩷🩶👀🧨💯 And me absolutely wonderful player, loved him. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
east lower Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 3 hours ago, boratsbrother said: Indeed! Just carrying on at our 2024 level we'll almost certainly finish 4th at worse. That is unless there's a significant improvement from a Villa, Spurs, Untied or Newcastle and I honestly don't see significant improvement in any of those teams. I expect Newcastle and Spurs to be the level they are now. Villa to fall back with Utd maybe overtaking one or two of those three but not enough to keep up with us. Sort our defence out and we'll seriously challenge Liverpool for third. Did you watch that game on Saturday? We were a level below ordinary for 80 minutes against the fourth worst team in the league. Arguably they were the better side. And once more we had to score 3 (or more at times) to win. A proper coach who can get a consistent performance, get some organisation and discipline into what we have - MAY get us into the top four. Jackson marshalling Boly at set pieces, it’s so bad it’s ameteur. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boratsbrother Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 19 minutes ago, east lower said: Did you watch that game on Saturday? We were a level below ordinary for 80 minutes against the fourth worst team in the league. Arguably they were the better side. And once more we had to score 3 (or more at times) to win. A proper coach who can get a consistent performance, get some organisation and discipline into what we have - MAY get us into the top four. Jackson marshalling Boly at set pieces, it’s so bad it’s ameteur. If the coaching is so bad, how are we already 10 points better off this season? Almost doubled our number of goals? The fourth best team in 2024? Are you another one who expected a new manager to come in and take a midfield team straight back to the top four and fix every aerea of the team in one season? Did you expect a very inexperienced team at this level to gel in one season and be top four? Have you forgot that a much better City team were relatively average in Pep's first season? Forgot that Liverpool were defensively dodgy for Klopps first two years? Poch isn't their level, but you somehow expect him to do better and with a worse team. The goalposts for what would be acceptable for a first season have been moved so much they're not even on the pitch now. If we lose he's slagged off for losing because all that matters is the result. If we win but the performance isn't good, then he's slagged off for the performance. I think you and the anti Poch section are the ones that's losing out on the enjoyment to be had from watching a young team being built and progressing. I saw the unbridled joy behind that goal on Saturday. Same with the Utd game. Spurs game. West Ham game. Their reaction is good enough for me. Anyway, Poch's critics on here are now being significantly outnumbered by former players, pundits, journos and even fans of other teams, who are all saying we are on the right track and Poch is doing a good job. Equally, all of them are saying the team is far from the finished article but will improve as they gain experience. But as always. Although I wildly disagree with your opinion, i respect it all the same. Each to their own and all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
east lower Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 1 minute ago, boratsbrother said: If the coaching is so bad, how are we already 10 points better off this season? Almost doubled our number of goals? The fourth best team in 2024? Are you another one who expected a new manager to come in and take a midfield team straight back to the top four and fix every aerea of the team in one season? Did you expect a very inexperienced team at this level to gel in one season and be top four? Have you forgot that a much better City team were relatively average in Pep's first season? Forgot that Liverpool were defensively dodgy for Klopps first two years? Poch isn't their level, but you somehow expect him to do better and with a worse team. The goalposts for what would be acceptable for a first season have been moved so much they're not even on the pitch now. If we lose he's slagged off for losing because all that matters is the result. If we win but the performance isn't good, then he's slagged off for the performance. I think you and the anti Poch section are the ones that's losing out on the enjoyment to be had from watching a young team being built and progressing. I saw the unbridled joy behind that goal on Saturday. Same with the Utd game. Spurs game. West Ham game. Their reaction is good enough for me. Anyway, Poch's critics on here are now being significantly outnumbered by former players, pundits, journos and even fans of other teams, who are all saying we are on the right track and Poch is doing a good job. Equally, all of them are saying the team is far from the finished article but will improve as they gain experience. But as always. Although I wildly disagree with your opinion, i respect it all the same. Each to their own and all that. Didn’t watch it then! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kelly Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 21 minutes ago, boratsbrother said: If the coaching is so bad, how are we already 10 points better off this season? Almost doubled our number of goals? The fourth best team in 2024? Are you another one who expected a new manager to come in and take a midfield team straight back to the top four and fix every aerea of the team in one season? Did you expect a very inexperienced team at this level to gel in one season and be top four? Have you forgot that a much better City team were relatively average in Pep's first season? Forgot that Liverpool were defensively dodgy for Klopps first two years? Poch isn't their level, but you somehow expect him to do better and with a worse team. The goalposts for what would be acceptable for a first season have been moved so much they're not even on the pitch now. If we lose he's slagged off for losing because all that matters is the result. If we win but the performance isn't good, then he's slagged off for the performance. I think you and the anti Poch section are the ones that's losing out on the enjoyment to be had from watching a young team being built and progressing. I saw the unbridled joy behind that goal on Saturday. Same with the Utd game. Spurs game. West Ham game. Their reaction is good enough for me. Anyway, Poch's critics on here are now being significantly outnumbered by former players, pundits, journos and even fans of other teams, who are all saying we are on the right track and Poch is doing a good job. Equally, all of them are saying the team is far from the finished article but will improve as they gain experience. But as always. Although I wildly disagree with your opinion, i respect it all the same. Each to their own and all that. We'd be twenty points better off if he'd done anything earlier on in the season. Chaos football is fine to a point and that point is where he fails, time and time again and he will eventually fail here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiago97 Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 3 minutes ago, Mark Kelly said: We'd be twenty points better off if he'd done anything earlier on in the season. Chaos football is fine to a point and that point is where he fails, time and time again and he will eventually fail here. Feel sorry for the new guy already. If this supposed bang average manager could have us 20pts better off by having us more organised, it means any half decent coach should be on for 77pts minimum next season 😳 Some lofty expectations being set for any new manager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kelly Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Thiago97 said: Feel sorry for the new guy already. If this supposed bang average manager could have us 20pts better off by having us more organised, it means any half decent coach should be on for 77pts minimum next season 😳 Some lofty expectations being set for any new manager Well if you can stop the dithering because nobody has it drilled into them where they should be at any given time you can stop the dopey conceded goals that is the fruit of the dithering. He's capable of doing it, the pro Poch guys should really be looking into why he hasn't bothered and questioning him. I'm resigned to him getting another season now and there is definitely a "but what if the new bloke is worse aspect to it" on my behalf. As I've said time and again , I just want him to be better. Edited May 13 by Mark Kelly 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiago97 Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 3 minutes ago, Mark Kelly said: Well if you can stop the dithering because nobody has it drilled into them where they should be at any given time you can stop the dopey conceded goals that is the fruit of the dithering. He's capable of doing it, the pro Poch guys should really be looking into why he hasn't bothered and questioning him. I'm resigned to him getting another season now and there is definitely a "but what if the new bloke is worse aspect to it" on my behalf. As I've said time and again , I just want him to be better. I think we both know it’s not as simple as described here. I suppose all I’m really looking for from anyone who thinks Poch is a bad manager , coward , clown etc, to own it that any new manager HAS to do better than the points Poch has achieved this season. If it’s more the manager than the players, if we take into account another season of progress for young players, take into account that we are unlikely to have such bad injuries agin, and take into account we will be improving the team in some capacity………all those things mean that any new manager has to improve from where we are now. Yet every time I hint at this to the Poch knockers, no-one seems to want to commit to saying that any new manager needs to improve on what Poch has done! Which leads me to think that deep down they are not that convinced a new man does better, but happy to use Poch as the scapegoat for why things are not as good as they should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
east lower Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 4 minutes ago, Thiago97 said: I think we both know it’s not as simple as described here. I suppose all I’m really looking for from anyone who thinks Poch is a bad manager , coward , clown etc, to own it that any new manager HAS to do better than the points Poch has achieved this season. If it’s more the manager than the players, if we take into account another season of progress for young players, take into account that we are unlikely to have such bad injuries agin, and take into account we will be improving the team in some capacity………all those things mean that any new manager has to improve from where we are now. Yet every time I hint at this to the Poch knockers, no-one seems to want to commit to saying that any new manager needs to improve on what Poch has done! Which leads me to think that deep down they are not that convinced a new man does better, but happy to use Poch as the scapegoat for why things are not as good as they should be. Tell you what, you name some replacements and I’ll tell you if they’d do better or not. Can’t be fairer and more transparent than that. If I’ve an opinion on a subject matter, then I have no issue with voicing it or indeed backing my judgement, so I’d rather you not generalise and just name those you’re referring to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiago97 Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 2 minutes ago, east lower said: Tell you what, you name some replacements and I’ll tell you if they’d do better or not. Can’t be fairer and more transparent than that. If I’ve an opinion on a subject matter, then I have no issue with voicing it or indeed backing my judgement, so I’d rather you not generalise and just name those you’re referring to. Does it really matter who I name? If he is that average, if it is mostly the players ability that has been the overriding factor for us being where we are, in a positive sense, if he is a bad coach and not a winning coach……then surely it doesn’t really matter does it. If we do appoint a new manager, it’s going to be someone who has achieved something positive in his most recent job, or someone with a positive track record for some success. So surely it’s easy to say that any new manager has to be judged on what Poch achieved as a minimum ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
east lower Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Thiago97 said: Does it really matter who I name? If he is that average, if it is mostly the players ability that has been the overriding factor for us being where we are, in a positive sense, if he is a bad coach and not a winning coach……then surely it doesn’t really matter does it. If we do appoint a new manager, it’s going to be someone who has achieved something positive in his most recent job, or someone with a positive track record for some success. So surely it’s easy to say that any new manager has to be judged on what Poch achieved as a minimum ? Suggest a few or are you devoid of any idea, or just being obtuse? Edited May 13 by east lower Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiago97 Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 5 minutes ago, east lower said: Suggest a few or are you devoid of any idea, or just being obtuse? Tried to pick a balanced and mixed selection of young and older. Conte , Howe , Mourinho , Tuchel , Kompany, Zidane , Gary O’Neill , Ancelotti , Amorim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
east lower Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Thiago97 said: Tried to pick a balanced and mixed selection of young and older. Conte , Howe , Mourinho , Tuchel , Kompany, Zidane , Gary O’Neill , Ancelotti , Amorim Yes, No, Yes, Yes, No, Yes, No, Yes, Don’t know enough about him - In the same order. Theme being winners vs also rans and the current coach falls into the latter group. Edited May 13 by east lower 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiago97 Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 1 minute ago, east lower said: Yes, No, Yes, Yes, No, Yes, No, Yes, Don’t know enough about him - In the same order. Interesting that the three who are PL managers you said no to all three. You can’t seriously think Zidane would do better than Poch !? Anyway, slightly pointless excercise really. If/when the new manager does come in, then is the time to answer the question really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
east lower Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 4 minutes ago, Thiago97 said: Interesting that the three who are PL managers you said no to all three. You can’t seriously think Zidane would do better than Poch !? Anyway, slightly pointless excercise really. If/when the new manager does come in, then is the time to answer the question really. Howe’s a one/two season fixer, O’Neill showed promise but seems to have fallen when the challenge got tougher, Kompany is too idealistic and not practical enough. Zidane is a winner and commands a certain element of respect. Won more than our coach and PSG had far more of a monopoly than Madrid did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiago97 Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 2 minutes ago, east lower said: Howe’s a one/two season fixer, O’Neill showed promise but seems to have fallen when the challenge got tougher, Kompany is too idealistic and not practical enough. Zidane is a winner and commands a certain element of respect. Won more than our coach and PSG had far more of a monopoly than Madrid did. I don’t really disagree on the PL managers, just thought it was interesting. Not having Zidane though. Had one job , at a club he knows inside out who are one of the biggest clubs on the world, and with great players. He deserves respect for what he did, but that wouldn’t translate to him being a successful manager elsewhere. Which is probably why no club has moved heaven and earth to appoint him since, and probably why he hasn’t jumped back in too. Zidane would be Scolari MKII, fans would be picking Poch back up from the airport to replace him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
east lower Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 1 minute ago, Thiago97 said: I don’t really disagree on the PL managers, just thought it was interesting. Not having Zidane though. Had one job , at a club he knows inside out who are one of the biggest clubs on the world, and with great players. He deserves respect for what he did, but that wouldn’t translate to him being a successful manager elsewhere. Which is probably why no club has moved heaven and earth to appoint him since, and probably why he hasn’t jumped back in too. Zidane would be Scolari MKII, fans would be picking Poch back up from the airport to replace him. Not this fan! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thiago97 Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 3 minutes ago, east lower said: Not this fan! I don’t think Mourinho , Conte improves our points with the squad either. Ancelotti I would say probably on par with what we have done this season. Tuchel as a manager I would say does improve on Poch, but with the history with the owners, I’m doubtful improvement would happen 2nd time around. Things would get too tetchy too soon. Amorim I also don’t know enough. Anyhow, we can revisit soon enough if changes happen. I stand by my comment Poch convenient scapegoat. No way does a manager come in and make this squad ball park 63-70pts next season , unless 3-4 top quality players added . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
east lower Posted May 13 Share Posted May 13 Squad wasn’t as bad as people make out. Confidence was destroyed by incompetence at the coaching level. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xceleryx Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 3 hours ago, east lower said: Squad wasn’t as bad as people make out. Confidence was destroyed by incompetence at the coaching level. Or it's just taken time for a new set of players to gel and gain understanding, confidence, and grow as both players and people given the age demographic a lot of them reside within. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sleeping Dave Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 On 10/05/2024 at 17:36, Thiago97 said: Those who think we should have been doing better with this squad are setting incredibly high expectations for any new manager. It’s hard to think we will have a repeat of the same injuries next season, added to some new players to be added to the squad. So if Poch should have been doing better, well any new guy is going to have very few excuses from next season. The club and some fans should really be care what it wishes for ! Well said - I find myself firmly in this camp. Our squad isn’t a top PL squad. Perhaps these names would be in a few years, but the squad is too young and inexperienced to challenge now. We are likely to end the season with 60+ points, a vast improvement from last year’s 44. It’s been clear progress and it’s been made in his first season under difficult circumstances. Give him more time, it’ll take time to rebuild this club to solid top four challenger year after year. Perhaps he isn’t the man to make us title challengers, but such concerns are way premature. First we need to stabilise in the top four and then we can start worrying whether he can win titles for us. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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