Mauricio Pochettino leaves Chelsea by mutual consent

[Max Fowler]

1 hour ago, Mark Kelly said:

News just in 

After the defeat to Newcastle, Poch threatened them all with two days extra training but actually gave them two days off and took them all out for a meal on him. 

Now, after the defeat to Everton it's being reported that the players had an Xmas night out in London by the Telegraph. 

Apparently Reece James decided it would be a good "bonding exercise". 

No reports forthcoming of how "limpy" he was. 

I expect all our forwards "hit the bar". 

Slipping standards at the club generally. I don't blame it on Poch.

[Max Fowler]

5 minutes ago, xceleryx said:

It's as it says on the tin really.

Take the starting position we were in this summer once clearing out everyone we did, to then build out a team that filled all our needs would've been just as challenging, carried just as much financial cost (since established players of the quality we'd be targeting generally demand higher wages), and arguably taken more time because teams are less likely to want to sell their more proven players if they're pivotal to their current team. 

You then turn around and look at all the transfers made this window of players between 23-30 and the top 25 transfers all cost upwards of €42m (roughly £36m), and the quality is pretty stretched. Two of those players in that 25 are our own Nkunku and Disasi, and two were sales we made in Havertz and Mount. While there's some nice players there, there's also many who most would also turn their nose up over if signed. 

I haven't done the math to work out just home much of the £1bn spent has been on genuine first team players we're using at present, but whatever that value is probably wouldn't have assembled a particularly strong established group either based on how the market unfolded. Then if it didn't work out and we still struggled for whatever reason we'd arguably be in a deeper hole, trying to once again shift high earners to clubs where most teams outside of England cannot afford them unless they're the big dogs of their league. 

You are living in upside down land.

You are not arguing that it is "easier" to build a team based on established players - you are arguing it is more sustainable.

[xceleryx]

12 minutes ago, Max Fowler said:

You are living in upside down land.

You are not arguing that it is "easier" to build a team based on established players - you are arguing it is more sustainable.

Neither actually, I'm saying it's just as challenging and comes with just as much financial risk, if arguably more because history shows, and as we all know, higher wages are a nightmare to actually shift.

We already saw how people reacted to Sterling, Koulibaly, Auba etc when we signed a few established options and they didn't deliver. 

[Max Fowler]

2 minutes ago, xceleryx said:

Neither actually, I'm saying it's just as challenging and comes with just as much financial risk, if arguably more because history shows, and as we all know, higher wages are a nightmare to actually shift.

We already saw how people reacted to Sterling, Koulibaly, Auba etc when we signed a few established options and they didn't deliver. 

You didn't say that though, you unequivocally stated:

"It would've been harder, if not near impossible, to just rebuild through proven established options alone initially."

"How people reacted" isn't the point.

[Mark Kelly]

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/mauricio-pochettino-doesnt-need-to-buy-just-improve-what-he-has-h90ch0kjz

[Dwmh]

2 minutes ago, Mark Kelly said:

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/mauricio-pochettino-doesnt-need-to-buy-just-improve-what-he-has-h90ch0kjz

The headline is spot on.  the text is nonsense as ever - it is Henry Winter.
 

Quote

Mauricio Pochettino enjoys a well-deserved reputation for developing players from his time at Southampton and Tottenham Hotspur. A quarter of England’s probable outfield squad for Euro 2024, and almost one third of their likely starting XI, made their international debuts while at clubs under the Argentinian.

Pochettino clearly knows how to coach and improve players.

He had great scouts who brought him great talent - I think we all know now how Southampton worked.

He is not being bailed out by the scouts now.

[Mark Kelly]

Just now, Dwmh said:

The headline is spot on.  the text is nonsense as ever - it is Henry Winter.
 

He had great scouts who brought him great talent - I think we all know now how Southampton worked.

He is not being bailed out by the scouts now.

I still think many of them are better players than his "coaching" is allowing for.

[ROTG]

2 hours ago, xceleryx said:

Neither actually, I'm saying it's just as challenging and comes with just as much financial risk, if arguably more because history shows, and as we all know, higher wages are a nightmare to actually shift.

We already saw how people reacted to Sterling, Koulibaly, Auba etc when we signed a few established options and they didn't deliver. 

We are in deeper poop now than spending a third of the wasted money to bolster the squad we started with at the beginning of 22/23 season. 
 

you don’t get blue chip sponsors or revenue from European adventures and even CWC if you finish a lowly 10th. 
 

Next time poch is being interviewed at the bridges count the number of sponsors on the background board compared to top team and ourselves before the upstairs epiphany stated. 
 

Next you be saying we will not be impacted by FFP if we continue to finish mid table and no European football. 

[ROTG]

39 minutes ago, Dwmh said:

The headline is spot on.  the text is nonsense as ever - it is Henry Winter.

Nothing is spot on when written by winter  SAF ghosts writer and hated everything about Chelsea under RA times. 
 

He is a dinosaur journalist “top of the Barclay Bankers league”

Edited December 12, 2023 by ROTG
Could happily throw something at the TV when his face appears

[Max Fowler]

Here we go... the countdown has begun.

 

 

[Dwmh]

8 minutes ago, Max Fowler said:

Here we go... the countdown has begun.

 

 

This just doesn't make any sense.  Watch Chelsea, everyone knows something must happen, but nothing will.
Why follow this guy?  Why repeat it?

[Max Fowler]

1 minute ago, Dwmh said:

This just doesn't make any sense.  Watch Chelsea, everyone knows something must happen, but nothing will.
Why follow this guy?  Why repeat it?

Fabrizio is one of the most reliable journos. It’s entering the next phase of the cycle: Poch is going nowhere - Something needs to change - Poch is sacked.

[blueboy1905]

5 hours ago, Mark Kelly said:

News just in 

After the defeat to Newcastle, Poch threatened them all with two days extra training but actually gave them two days off and took them all out for a meal on him. 

Now, after the defeat to Everton it's being reported that the players had an Xmas night out in London by the Telegraph. 

Apparently Reece James decided it would be a good "bonding exercise". 

No reports forthcoming of how "limpy" he was. 

I expect all our forwards "hit the bar". 

Apparently if we do not get the desired result on Saturday v Sheffield Utd Poch has also threatened to cancel the teams trip to Winter Wonderland including limitless Gluwhein and candy canes thrown in. R.J has already been banned from the bumper car rides as he'll probably lose both legs. Sources at the club reveal if this happens Todd Brokely and Egghead will perform an impromptu nativity scene in the changing room post match.

Edited December 12, 2023 by blueboy1905
Spelling

[Dwmh]

Just now, Max Fowler said:

Fabrizio is one of the most reliable journos. It’s entering the next phase of the cycle: Poch is going nowhere - Something needs to change - Poch is sacked.

So why are you following Pys not Fabreezio?  And why quote obvious self-contradictions?

[Max Fowler]

9 minutes ago, Dwmh said:

So why are you following Pys not Fabreezio?  And why quote obvious self-contradictions?

He quotes the quotes!

[Max Fowler]

 

Losing the dressing room

[Thiago97]

19 minutes ago, Max Fowler said:

 

Losing the dressing room

Jeez get a grip Max! If this was a story, it would have started to leak back in September. Do you not question that it has conveniently come out after 3 defeats…..as a story it is just a nonsense. Even if there is some merit in Silva being appointed captain back in August . 

Edited December 13, 2023 by Thiago97

[Max Fowler]

7 minutes ago, Thiago97 said:

Jeez get a grip Max! If this was a story, it would have started to leak back in September. Do you not question that it has conveniently come out after 3 defeats…..as a story it is just a nonsense. Even if there is some merit in Silva being appointed captain back in August . 

Not saying it's 100, but rumours will start trickling. To be honest I find it more ridiculous that the Chelsea journalists (Simon Johnson, Liam Twomey) are putting a wall of denial up that Poch's position isn't under threat - "The club keep saying they are still fully behind Pochettino". What rubbish - we were with here with Potter. They put the same wall up for weeks until finally, magically, Potter got fired. What a surprise! Again - we have been on this rollercoaster ride many times before, and there is clearly something wrong in the dressing room, whether that's Poch losing it, lack of characters and leaders, or being devoid of pressure from the powers that be.

[Sciatika]

Here is the original story:

Chelsea players baffled by Thiago Silva captain snub after Reece James injury | Chelsea | The Guardian

"Chelsea’s squad remains supportive of Mauricio Pochettino after a disappointing start...". When you read the article, it says very little. I would take any article by Jacob Steinberg with a massive pinch of salt. He has been writing puff pieces criticising Chelsea for years probably because his club (West Ham) hasn't won anything for a very long time. But let's say that was not the case. What do you think about this one:

Chelsea’s youth plan is paying dividends while United’s passengers linger | Chelsea | The Guardian

[Sciatika]

Maybe this one:

 

[Dwmh]

2 hours ago, Sciatika said:

What do you think about this one:

Chelsea’s youth plan is paying dividends while United’s passengers linger | Chelsea | The Guardian

written by @xceleryx I'd guess.
Look at the players who have come in and been a success (defined by being picked, not being successful).
Of the Chelsea youth, Colwill and Maatsen are not getting picked now.  Broja has 3 starts.
Of the imported youth even expensive 19 yos like Big Les aren't getting picked, nor is Madueke.
 

The only youngsters getting picked are Badashile (when fit) Jackson Caicedo, Fernandez and Palmer.
2 cost £100m+, Jackson is picked but a flop (cost £32m and is 22), Palmer is the one real success (at £40m) and Badashile (£33m, 22 and only 3 starts so far this season)

Other new players like Sanchez, Cucurella, Sterling are 25+.

I can't see the dividends we are getting in the players, never mind the results.

 

[xceleryx]

1 minute ago, Dwmh said:

written by @xceleryx I'd guess.
Look at the players who have come in and been a success (defined by being picked, not being successful).
Of the Chelsea youth, Colwill and Maatsen are not getting picked now.  Broja has 3 starts.
Of the imported youth even expensive 19 yos like Big Les aren't getting picked, nor is Madueke.
 

The only youngsters getting picked are Badashile (when fit) Jackson Caicedo, Fernandez and Palmer.
2 cost £100m+, Jackson is picked but a flop (cost £32m and is 22), Palmer is the one real success (at £40m) and Badashile (£33m, 22 and only 3 starts so far this season)

Other new players like Sanchez, Cucurella, Sterling are 25+.

I can't see the dividends we are getting in the players, never mind the results.

Lol. 

Colwill has been picked in every league game bar one, sitting 7th in terms of most minutes played. The game he missed, vs Man City, was because of a shoulder injury. 

Maatsen hasn't been good whenever he has featured. I dare say his refusal to sign a new deal has also played a part, as we're not going to invest too much into a player that'll either be sold in January or leaves on a free in the summer. 

Broja returned from a serious injury, so a portion of the season has been used to slowly reintegrate him. When he has had an opportunity, he's again looked a million miles away and many commenting how much worse he was than Jackson vs Everton. 

Ugo is virtually foil for Caicedo, who has 12 starts and 2 sub appearance. With Caicedo available he isn't going to play, no shocker there.

Madueke's a curious case and I dare say that little nightclub incident earlier in the season didn't help his cause. 

Context certainly changes how you've tried to sell it. 

[Dwmh]

30 minutes ago, xceleryx said:

Lol. 

Colwill has been picked in every league game bar one, sitting 7th in terms of most minutes played. The game he missed, vs Man City, was because of a shoulder injury. 

Maatsen hasn't been good whenever he has featured. I dare say his refusal to sign a new deal has also played a part, as we're not going to invest too much into a player that'll either be sold in January or leaves on a free in the summer. 

Broja returned from a serious injury, so a portion of the season has been used to slowly reintegrate him. When he has had an opportunity, he's again looked a million miles away and many commenting how much worse he was than Jackson vs Everton. 

Ugo is virtually foil for Caicedo, who has 12 starts and 2 sub appearance. With Caicedo available he isn't going to play, no shocker there.

Madueke's a curious case and I dare say that little nightclub incident earlier in the season didn't help his cause. 

Context certainly changes how you've tried to sell it. 

Colwill aside you are just highlighting how the youth we paid less than £100m is not making an impact in a team which was stripped of experience players to make room for that youth.

Meanwhile Moreira, Washingon, lavia, Fofana D, Petrovic, Hutchinson, Chukwuemeka, Casadei, Santos, all arrived to some fanfair and cost, but are making absolutely no impact on the first team whatsoever.

There are no FFing Dividends.  Just promises.  Wake up.

Note - dividends are the payback, when your investment actually starts paying you back.  That is the literal definition of a dividend.  Potential, even increased potential, is not dividend.  Only sales fees and performances in the first team count.

[ROTG]

4 hours ago, Max Fowler said:

 

Losing the dressing room

Yawn

[ROTG]

4 hours ago, Max Fowler said:

Not saying it's 100, but rumours will start trickling. To be honest I find it more ridiculous that the Chelsea journalists (Simon Johnson, Liam Twomey) are putting a wall of denial up that Poch's position isn't under threat - "The club keep saying they are still fully behind Pochettino". What rubbish - we were with here with Potter. They put the same wall up for weeks until finally, magically, Potter got fired. What a surprise! Again - we have been on this rollercoaster ride many times before, and there is clearly something wrong in the dressing room, whether that's Poch losing it, lack of characters and leaders, or being devoid of pressure from the powers that be.

It’s very obvious the back me or sack me stance by Poch has accelerated from next summer to this Christmas. 
 

It’s going to be down to Clearlake to decide who they will support going forward Poch or TBSD. Whoever Clearlake support it should signal end for the other party. 

Edited December 13, 2023 by ROTG