Mauricio Pochettino leaves Chelsea by mutual consent

[Mark Kelly]

17 minutes ago, Ham said:

I've never seen a Chelsea player miss the target on TOCWS.

 

They all look like World beaters on there don't they!

[McCreadie]

Tonight is enough for me. I’ve tried to give him the benefit of the doubt until the end of the season, but I can’t get past match  day 32. Get him out. Get Tuchel back. Do it now.

[Mark Kelly]

1 minute ago, McCreadie said:

Tonight is enough for me. I’ve tried to give him the benefit of the doubt until the end of the season, but I can’t get past match  day 32. Get him out. Get Tuchel back. Do it now.

If he stays another season he'll relegate us. 

[Bert19]

Leave him at the fucking Emirates and let him make his own way home. I hope he’s already been sacked. 

[east lower]

I hope they Carlo’d his arse!!

[Miguelito07]

good info

[Proud-Blue]

14 minutes ago, Miguelito07 said:

good info

Was about to link the same. I think he's trying to be a bit charitable to Poch, but the evidence is damning. 

Our next manager will need a completely different tactical setup if we are to proceed with this squad. 

[CarefreeMuratcan]

We don't want this Tottenham manager at our Club anymore please. 

[Thiago97]

The result expected, the performance also expected to some degree, given the context of Saturday and where these players are at.

A team playing close to the top of its game right now with everything to play for, against a team coming into this without its best player and off the back of season ending disappointment. Last night was inevitable and I believe most people know that.

This result alone has no bearing on Poch future, and neither should it.

How we perform through to the finish of the season very much has an impact of if Poch should be here next season.

 

[east lower]

13 minutes ago, Thiago97 said:

The result expected, the performance also expected to some degree, given the context of Saturday and where these players are at.

A team playing close to the top of its game right now with everything to play for, against a team coming into this without its best player and off the back of season ending disappointment. Last night was inevitable and I believe most people know that.

This result alone has no bearing on Poch future, and neither should it.

How we perform through to the finish of the season very much has an impact of if Poch should be here next season.

 

I disagreed with your post, not the bit about the expectation around the result - a few were absolutely predicting this and it was very predictable in and around the circumstances you quote.

This person in charge of the playing side has already done so much damage to the players and disrespected a couple of acclaimed players that he should have gone months ago. He should not be allowed another minute here, let alone the remainder of the season.

[My Blood Is Blue]

17 minutes ago, Thiago97 said:

The result expected, the performance also expected to some degree, given the context of Saturday and where these players are at.

A team playing close to the top of its game right now with everything to play for, against a team coming into this without its best player and off the back of season ending disappointment. Last night was inevitable and I believe most people know that.

This result alone has no bearing on Poch future, and neither should it.

How we perform through to the finish of the season very much has an impact of if Poch should be here next season.

 

Respectfully, I disagree. The result expected, as in a defeat, yes, but no fan expects (nor should they) their side to go out and perform as badly as they did last night and make no mistake, Poch played a big part in that with his selection.

If we accept nights like last night, when ultimately we are battling for a European space, then things are only going to get worse.

I don’t think they’ll sack him today or even in the summer, but they should and it shouldn’t be just him that goes.

[Thiago97]

51 minutes ago, My Blood Is Blue said:

Respectfully, I disagree. The result expected, as in a defeat, yes, but no fan expects (nor should they) their side to go out and perform as badly as they did last night and make no mistake, Poch played a big part in that with his selection.

If we accept nights like last night, when ultimately we are battling for a European space, then things are only going to get worse.

I don’t think they’ll sack him today or even in the summer, but they should and it shouldn’t be just him that goes.

The overriding point here a that too many are making judgements on knee jerk reactions to performances at the time.

Last night told nobody anything they didn’t or shouldn’t already know. 
We are more than capable of that performance. For balance, the previous 1 defeat in 10 or so games didn’t mean we were/are on the right track either. It was some small progress within the bigger picture at the club.

If the players mentality and performance over the next month suggest they are on the beach now, or that they are no longer buying into Poch. Then he will be replaced in the summer. 

If we regroup and put in some good performances and results , then he deserves a second season and hopefully with some experienced leaders to aid the cause next season. One shit result and performances changes nothing with why we already knew, no point to the obvious overreaction to it . 

[boratsbrother]

1 hour ago, My Blood Is Blue said:

Respectfully, I disagree. The result expected, as in a defeat, yes, but no fan expects (nor should they) their side to go out and perform as badly as they did last night and make no mistake, Poch played a big part in that with his selection.

If we accept nights like last night, when ultimately we are battling for a European space, then things are only going to get worse.

I don’t think they’ll sack him today or even in the summer, but they should and it shouldn’t be just him that goes.

Fans are understandably upset but let's try and take emotion out of the responses and examine the whole performance, not just after their second goal went it.

After a terrible opening 15 mins the lads started to settle and faught their way back into the game. We were holding our own and looking dangerous in attack but unable to create the clear cut chances. Even so, most of us seemed happy going in only one down and the commentators also saying we were playing well and giving them a game.

Then into the second half. As  happened so often this season we started badly and that was down to us making a couple of sloppy passes which put us under pressure aftee which we didn't get out of our half again until they scored. I knew a minute they scored a goal was coming and after that we would fall apart, which we sadly did.

Good mentality and effort got us back into that game but awful mentality undid that good work and handed  the game to them.

I'm not going to make excuses for the selection of Badiashile and Enzo  Neither should be playing in their current desperate state and that is on Poch!

Adding to the selection  problems now is the form of Petrovich. Beaten yet again at the near post and simply lost the air of confidence  and assurance he had when he came into the team.  On this form there's no way we can go into next season with him being our number one 

 

 

 

[Chelsea_Matt]

7 minutes ago, boratsbrother said:

Fans are understandably upset but let's try and take emotion out of the responses and examine the whole performance, not just after their second goal went it.

After a terrible opening 15 mins the lads started to settle and faught their way back into the game. We were holding our own and looking dangerous in attack but unable to create the clear cut chances. Even so, most of us seemed happy going in only one down and the commentators also saying we were playing well and giving them a game.

Then into the second half. As  happened so often this season we started badly and that was down to us making a couple of sloppy passes which put us under pressure aftee which we didn't get out of our half again until they scored. I knew a minute they scored a goal was coming and after that we would fall apart, which we sadly did.

Good mentality and effort got us back into that game but awful mentality undid that good work and handed  the game to them.

I'm not going to make excuses for the selection of Badiashile and Enzo  Neither should be playing in their current desperate state and that is on Poch!

Adding to the selection  problems now is the form of Petrovich. Beaten yet again at the near post and simply lost the air of confidence  and assurance he had when he came into the team.  On this form there's no way we can go into next season with him being our number one 

 

 

 

It’s not about emotion; it was a genuinely even more alarming performance than we’ve seen even after the clown show of the last two years imo.

We need a new manager and a whole new sporting department. Get in an ex-Chelsea man and a couple of proper football-savvy people and we CAN make a better go of it next season imo.

[My Blood Is Blue]

23 minutes ago, Thiago97 said:

The overriding point here a that too many are making judgements on knee jerk reactions to performances at the time.

Last night told nobody anything they didn’t or shouldn’t already know. 
We are more than capable of that performance. For balance, the previous 1 defeat in 10 or so games didn’t mean we were/are on the right track either. It was some small progress within the bigger picture at the club.

If the players mentality and performance over the next month suggest they are on the beach now, or that they are no longer buying into Poch. Then he will be replaced in the summer. 

If we regroup and put in some good performances and results , then he deserves a second season and hopefully with some experienced leaders to aid the cause next season. One shit result and performances changes nothing with why we already knew, no point to the obvious overreaction to it . 

The problem is, it isn't one shit result, is it...

West Ham 3-1 Chelsea
Chelsea 0-1 Nottingham Forest
Chelsea 0-2 Brentford
Newcastle 4-1 Chelsea
Manchester United 2-1 Chelsea
Everton 2-0 Chelsea
Wolves 2-1 Chelsea
Middlesbrough 1-0 Chelsea
Liverpool 4-1 Chelsea
Chelsea 2-4 Wolves
Brentford 2-2 Chelsea
Chelsea 2-2 Burnley
Sheffield United 2-2 Chelsea
Arsenal 5-0 Chelsea

This isn't just a list of where we've dropped points, these are the matches that I can look back on and think how awful we were in them. That's 14 in one season, that just isn't good enough. Poch came out after the game complaining that when we're bad we're really bad... whose fault is that? Yeah, the players take some of the blame, but when it keeps happening throughout the season, then you have to look at the man who is coaching them and preparing them for these games.

7 minutes ago, boratsbrother said:

Fans are understandably upset but let's try and take emotion out of the responses and examine the whole performance, not just after their second goal went it.

After a terrible opening 15 mins the lads started to settle and faught their way back into the game. We were holding our own and looking dangerous in attack but unable to create the clear cut chances. Even so, most of us seemed happy going in only one down and the commentators also saying we were playing well and giving them a game.

Then into the second half. As  happened so often this season we started badly and that was down to us making a couple of sloppy passes which put us under pressure aftee which we didn't get out of our half again until they scored. I knew a minute they scored a goal was coming and after that we would fall apart, which we sadly did.

Good mentality and effort got us back into that game but awful mentality undid that good work and handed  the game to them.

I'm not going to make excuses for the selection of Badiashile and Enzo  Neither should be playing in their current desperate state and that is on Poch!

Adding to the selection  problems now is the form of Petrovich. Beaten yet again at the near post and simply lost the air of confidence  and assurance he had when he came into the team.  On this form there's no way we can go into next season with him being our number one 

I agree, we did alright in the first half, especially considering how early on we conceded the first goal. That showed courage and determination, that showed all the things we needed to stay in the game and take it to the last 10/15 minutes, where the pressure would suddenly go on to Arsenal and nerves may kick in. A good manager plays on that and sends the team out pumped up and firing for the second half... ours didn't, he sent ours out in the second half as he normally does, bewildered and not ready to go.

[Box of Tricks]

This whole project has descended into one of those "who's responsible for the failure of this task?" situations from The Apprentice.

Pochettino, Stewart and Winstanley should all be brought back into the boardroom and a triple firing is the only rightful outcome.

Magic up another hotel to sell if you have to cover the costs, but just get them gone today. They are three incompetent conmen and if they stay into next season, then this club is screwed.

 

[Thiago97]

3 minutes ago, My Blood Is Blue said:

The problem is, it isn't one shit result, is it...

West Ham 3-1 Chelsea
Chelsea 0-1 Nottingham Forest
Chelsea 0-2 Brentford
Newcastle 4-1 Chelsea
Manchester United 2-1 Chelsea
Everton 2-0 Chelsea
Wolves 2-1 Chelsea
Middlesbrough 1-0 Chelsea
Liverpool 4-1 Chelsea
Chelsea 2-4 Wolves
Brentford 2-2 Chelsea
Chelsea 2-2 Burnley
Sheffield United 2-2 Chelsea
Arsenal 5-0 Chelsea

This isn't just a list of where we've dropped points, these are the matches that I can look back on and think how awful we were in them. That's 14 in one season, that just isn't good enough. Poch came out after the game complaining that when we're bad we're really bad... whose fault is that? Yeah, the players take some of the blame, but when it keeps happening throughout the season, then you have to look at the man who is coaching them and preparing them for these games.

I agree, we did alright in the first half, especially considering how early on we conceded the first goal. That showed courage and determination, that showed all the things we needed to stay in the game and take it to the last 10/15 minutes, where the pressure would suddenly go on to Arsenal and nerves may kick in. A good manager plays on that and sends the team out pumped up and firing for the second half... ours didn't, he sent ours out in the second half as he normally does, bewildered and not ready to go.

This is kinda the point I am making. I know it’s not one game, but it’s one game within a recent run. 
We win 3 and draw 1 in our next four, many will react based on those games. Just as they predictably have here.

Not long ago quite a few were in the camp of Petrovic has to play Sanchez is a liability. Gilchrist should start as he at least cares. Badiashille has to play to get a run of games. Silva shouldn’t be starting as we defend based on his lack of pace. 
The reality is none of this makes much difference really, cos we are simply not good enough as a defensive unit and individually.

Silva - we have seen a decline this year, understandable.

Badiashille - he has been dreadful

Disasi - bang average

Colwill - Jury still out

Gusto - a positive for sure, still makes mistakes

Chalobah - Steady to average 

Chilwell - Steady to average recently 

The ability to defend well is not just on defenders, but when this is the mix of options you are working with, then you are always gonna be struggling to control games and always be open to collapses of this nature. 
 

The book certainly stops with Poch, but let’s be clear he was working with one hand behind his back with most of this squad. It’s dreamland stuff to think any other manager is going to achieve much better things with this lot as the base of the defence !

[xceleryx]

I've defended Poch off and on over the course of the season but it's impossible to really do so again on the basis of that team selection alone. He set us up for defeat and that's exactly what we got. Granted, not having certain players available meant choices had to be made that weren't necessarily ideal, but that back four last night was not the one to be trying to experiment with. 

I like Gilchrist and his attitude, but the kid isn't quite at the level needed and he's far and away not a RB in any capacity. He was absolutely rinsed for the first goal, then throughout the game was frequently being told where he needed to be by others - Enzo in particular, when we had the ball. 

Unless fitness was an issue (not looked into it, so idk), but it would've made far more sense to shift Chalobah across to RB and partner Disasi and Thiago Silva together - two players that've played together for much of the season. Making the three changes he did had our defence all at sea. 

I can sympathise regarding the midfield situation to a degree. We've got several options out, have had to play Caicedo, Enzo and Gallagher into the ground, and Enzo himself is still dealing with the same hernia situation he's carried for much of the season. However, and maybe it's easier said now that we're virtually not going to win a cup and simply have a mid-table position to compete for, but I'd be shutting Enzo down and letting him sort his hernia thing out so he's 100% fit for next season. I'd get more minutes into Casadei and Chunk to finish out the season, even if that means dropping Gallagher back. We're not going to gain anything with how things stand now. 

But yeah, I'd be assessing our managerial options come the summer.

[My Blood Is Blue]

1 minute ago, Thiago97 said:

This is kinda the point I am making. I know it’s not one game, but it’s one game within a recent run. 
We win 3 and draw 1 in our next four, many will react based on those games. Just as they predictably have here.

Not long ago quite a few were in the camp of Petrovic has to play Sanchez is a liability. Gilchrist should start as he at least cares. Badiashille has to play to get a run of games. Silva shouldn’t be starting as we defend based on his lack of pace. 
The reality is none of this makes much difference really, cos we are simply not good enough as a defensive unit and individually.

Silva - we have seen a decline this year, understandable.

Badiashille - he has been dreadful

Disasi - bang average

Colwill - Jury still out

Gusto - a positive for sure, still makes mistakes

Chalobah - Steady to average 

Chilwell - Steady to average recently 

The ability to defend well is not just on defenders, but when this is the mix of options you are working with, then you are always gonna be struggling to control games and always be open to collapses of this nature. 
 

The book certainly stops with Poch, but let’s be clear he was working with one hand behind his back with most of this squad. It’s dreamland stuff to think any other manager is going to achieve much better things with this lot as the base of the defence !

My main issue with Poch last night, was making as many changes to the back 4 as he did... why take out Chalobah and Silva?! We were forced into Gusto not playing, so then keep the rest of the back 4 that have been playing together recently. We have been destroyed by injuries this season, which has disrupted us massively and not allowed us to build up the consistency in the selection that is needed, however, last night was self-inflicted and everyone has seen Badiashile's form this season, he shouldn't be being considered for selection at the moment at all.

[jasonb]

2 minutes ago, My Blood Is Blue said:

My main issue with Poch last night, was making as many changes to the back 4 as he did... why take out Chalobah and Silva?! We were forced into Gusto not playing, so then keep the rest of the back 4 that have been playing together recently. We have been destroyed by injuries this season, which has disrupted us massively and not allowed us to build up the consistency in the selection that is needed, however, last night was self-inflicted and everyone has seen Badiashile's form this season, he shouldn't be being considered for selection at the moment at all.

I agree ans suspect the medical team decided at 39 Silva needed a rest, otherwise it seems unexplainable.

Right back without Gusto was always going to be an issue and they took advantage.

[Thiago97]

Just now, My Blood Is Blue said:

My main issue with Poch last night, was making as many changes to the back 4 as he did... why take out Chalobah and Silva?! We were forced into Gusto not playing, so then keep the rest of the back 4 that have been playing together recently. We have been destroyed by injuries this season, which has disrupted us massively and not allowed us to build up the consistency in the selection that is needed, however, last night was self-inflicted and everyone has seen Badiashile's form this season, he shouldn't be being considered for selection at the moment at all.

I don’t disagree ref Badiashille, I wouldn’t have him near the team last night .

The game was 3 days after a game that involved a huge effort from the team.We know Silva age situation and Chalobah played quite a bit recently. Personally, I would have played both with Disasi at right back…..but we didn’t exactly have loads of options here really.

If we had played the back four that I and probably many would have gone with….would it have made a difference ? No it wouldn’t , cos they are not good enough to face up a team playing very well and at the top of their game. 
I don’t think the team selection was great last night, but as I have said, it’s also what quite a few have been wanting.  A thumping in this game , given its timing and context, and given the players we have, was inevitable.

It’s not good enough and it’s not about accepting it. It’s about being realistic , but also realistic and pragmatic enough to know it doesn’t tell us anything we didn’t already know. No manager is going to turn this group of defenders into mentally strong defensive animals, and if they could, it really would be to the detriment of us having much attacking threat . 

[Mark Kelly]

No manager is going to turn this defence into one by not trying to that's for certain. 

Maybe Pochettino can try coaching them? 

[Thiago97]

2 minutes ago, Mark Kelly said:

No manager is going to turn this defence into one by not trying to that's for certain. 

Maybe Pochettino can try coaching them? 

I'd argue its the one part of the game he actually knows the most about, given he was actually a centre half himself.

I head a couple of french football writers talk about Disasi when we signed him. Whilst they said he had some good attributes, the main comment that stuck in my head was that no-one at Monaco, or who followed french football closely , ever thought that a partnership of Badiashille/Disasi was some sort of rock solid defensive foundation that you would build your team around. Yet we decided it would be a good idea to splurge the best part of £80 million quid to make that happen!

You can be the best coach in the world, but you still need the raw materials to work with to actually coach any kind of difference.

[My Blood Is Blue]

4 minutes ago, Thiago97 said:

I'd argue its the one part of the game he actually knows the most about, given he was actually a centre half himself.

I head a couple of french football writers talk about Disasi when we signed him. Whilst they said he had some good attributes, the main comment that stuck in my head was that no-one at Monaco, or who followed french football closely , ever thought that a partnership of Badiashille/Disasi was some sort of rock solid defensive foundation that you would build your team around. Yet we decided it would be a good idea to splurge the best part of £80 million quid to make that happen!

You can be the best coach in the world, but you still need the raw materials to work with to actually coach any kind of difference.

And yet he chose to pick them both to play against this Arsenal side. He didn’t have to do that, but he did.

[Thiago97]

1 minute ago, My Blood Is Blue said:

And yet he chose to pick them both to play against this Arsenal side. He didn’t have to do that, but he did.

He also didn't sign them.

So we are gonna castigate the guy for using two of the options at his disposal and it not working out ? Managers get things wrong and make bad calls. He reacted to the circumstances and timing of the game, it ended up being a poor decision.

Had the game been at the weekend, do you think he would have started them both ? I don't for one minute, but he did and it was proven to be a mistake (though a mistake that didn't actually cost anything , as the alternative would have returned the same amount of points from the game)

If he starts them again at the weekend, when he has other options available to him. Then rightly so, blast the guy for it. He won't.