Chelsea 0 Fulham 0

[thevelourfog]

24 minutes ago, RDCW said:

"Courtesy, insults, pleasant" from you? ...... 😂 Stop it froggy, or I'll have to buy some incontinence pants.

In the words of Stephen Hawking, "All we have to do is keep talking! "

Wasn't sure there was an ignore function on the new site. At least I've had the impetus to check. 

Definitely go for the incontinence pants, ideally some that go over your mouth.

[RDCW]

5 minutes ago, thevelourfog said:

Wasn't sure there was an ignore function on the new site. At least I've had the impetus to check. 

Definitely go for the incontinence pants, ideally some that go over your mouth.

Glad you have decided to keep talking 😆 .

Pleasant come-back by the way.

[Proud-Blue]

I'm not sure if I'm quite as negative as some others after last night. Don't get me wrong, we should really win the game and there are still some concerns. But Enzo in particular looked like exactly what we've been missing in terms of distribution. I'd actually like to have seen him play alongside Jorginho which is a shame.

However, I suspect I'll get slated for this next point because it's a critique of Mount. To be clear, I love the guy. At his best he is class and I hope he remains at Chelsea for many years to come.

This said, his form is extremely poor and I think it is having an impact on our attacking output. His decision making seems to be getting worse, his key passes are going astray, and he simply doesn't score enough (though he's not alone in that). Last night he was played as a number 8 which he has claimed is his best position. If anything, I thought he looked even worse there. I noticed in particular that he, and to a lesser extent Gallagher, vacated the CM position once Enzo got the ball, making it extremely difficult for reliable forward passes to be played. This meant Enzo was frequently outnumbered and a lesser player would have been demolished.  It's possible he's being told to do this, but to me it just doesn't make sense. 

I think Mount needs dropping for a few games. Keep bringing him on and hopefully his form improves.

Perhaps less controversially are the problems with Havertz. I watched him in Germany and was among those who thought he was a generational talent. From what I've seen of him at Chelsea, he would at best be a decent squad player to have. He has his moments (Newcastle at home was pointed out), but his end product is similarly poor and he often looks like the pace of the league is too much for him. He'll always be part of our folklore because of the CL win, but as it stands he needs dropping too. 

We'll probably need to give D.D. Fofana up front for a few games to compensate for Havertz. Hopefully he can be the big bastard we've been missing up front for years.

Just to be clear that Mount and Havertz are not exclusively to blame for our problems. It's so many things, but these two are some issues that need rectifying quickly in my view.

[boratsbrother]

47 minutes ago, Blue Moon said:

Part of the problem derives from the suppression - rightly - of bad language and unwoke terms, resulting in quite a few of the old songs being discouraged / banned, and along with them the "cheerleaders" - one in the Shed lower in particular.

 

But where do you draw the line with this ?As with  comedy, what is offensive to one person can be an acceptable to another.

No half decent person ever wants to go back to the days of hearing disgusting, degrading monkey noises. Songs about the tragic deaths at Hillsborough, Hysel, Munich should also be off limits these days and so too the hissing at Spurs games. That isnt being woke (I'm most definitely not woke) they are basic things to do with common decency which people across the political divide should unite on and for the most part they largely do. 

Verbal abuse for being a Scouse, Manc, Geordie, Cockney or whatever else is fine by me. So too is most of the other questionable stuff (refs being barstewards and all that)  99.0% of fans would only ever shout or sing at a football match. Imho, it is still just a relatively harmless way of legging off  some steam and should be seen as just that, otherwise we will end up having atmospheres of a theatre or Opera.

 

[Thiago97]

2 hours ago, boratsbrother said:

I think some fans are getting a bit carried away with the potential for Enzo.

While I think he will be an upgrade on Jorginho, I don't see him making the kind of difference that we are looking for, especially for the record fee we paid for him. Despite the huge amount of money spent this season, we reamin desperately short of an out an out defensive midfielder and an out an out attacking, creative, goal scoring midfielder. Enzo is neither of those and I can see him being yet another midfielder who has technical ability on the ball but not elite ability in either half of the pitch. A level above the likes of Jorginho and Kova but not the 2 or 3 levels above which will help transform the team into title contenders again. I think we're looking at a solid 7-8 out of 10 level player here, not a superstar game changer in the making.

It seems you just rinse and repeat this for every signing we make. You seem to always find a negative issue, either the money paid, the player not being good enough or not being enough of a game changer. Yet you never mention players you would like, then question it as pointless discussion when others do.

You wanted Tuchel out and you wanted Potter in. You got what you wanted, try and enjoy it more with a semi positive post, once in a while. 

[Ham]

13 hours ago, paulw66 said:

 

And the last away win was.... Come on. 

 

5 hours ago, thevelourfog said:

Funny that point of mine wasn't responded to. Zagreb, in November. The home support really obviously is not a contributory factor to rubbish performances and results, no matter what you think of it.

This, and ...

Quite. It was a fairly average atmosphere for a game not against Spurs, Liverpool etc. for a good long while and died long after it became clear nothing was going to happen. Not ideal, but obviously understandable.

My bad about wins.  I must have misremembered that but I'm sure our performances away from home were better and that the players responded favourably to the fans after games.  

[martin1905]

3 hours ago, Holymoly said:

Are you aware of the contradiction in this sentence?

Well, it's not is it. At all.

[martin1905]

2 hours ago, ROTG said:

Emery W5 D1 L1 - went straight in after SteveG, implemented 442 formation and coached the team. - I am not a fan, however it proves that if you implement a system and coach to that system, you get results regardless of the playing staff

 

Indeed, he is just one of many examples too. 

I'm sure Everton will be a much better side today after only a week under the new manager. 

I doubt there are too many examples of a club going from where we were to where we are under a new manager though. I mean it says absolute everything.

[JaneB]

@thevelourfog @RDCW

Please guys, don’t make my job tricky already 😒

[Mark Kelly]

Just now, martin1905 said:

Indeed, he is just one of many examples too. 

I'm sure Everton will be a much better side today after only a week under the new manager. 

I doubt there are too many examples of a club going from where we were to where we are under a new manager though. I mean it says absolute everything.

So if Potter is absolutely clueless how does it explain the very easy on the eye football Brighton were playing under him particularly when we are still playing the same turgid football we were seeing in the last few months of Tuchel? 

Not looking for a row just genuinely interested what the answer is because everyone was saying how good Potters Brighton were despite their relatively unknown players.

[Ham]

3 hours ago, Mark Kelly said:

Possibly the most overrated band since the Rolling stones

If you're going to besmirch the Foo Fighters then I believe we're about to have our first falling out 🤘

[Mark Kelly]

Just now, Ham said:

If you're going to besmirch the Foo Fighters then I believe we're about to have our first falling out 🤘

I've got their greatest hits , which is OK , but they are feted as amazing which I think means they're overrated. There's two or three bangers but the rest is much of a muchness. I am honestly no barometer of musical taste to be frank , my Mrs has banned me from the in car music department!

[Thiago97]

4 minutes ago, Ham said:

If you're going to besmirch the Foo Fighters then I believe we're about to have our first falling out 🤘

Off topic. I remember you mentioning you like drumming or drummers in music.

Check out Black Midi. Takes a bit of getting  into, but these guys are insanely talented, especially the drummer! 

[Ham]

Just now, Thiago97 said:

Off topic. I remember you mentioning you like drumming or drummers in music.

Check out Black Midi. Takes a bit of getting  into, but these guys are insanely talented, especially the drummer! 

Well remembered.  Yes I play and I'm always looking for something to drum along to/learn.  I'll give them a listen 👍

[Mark Kelly]

Just now, Ham said:

Well remembered.  Yes I play and I'm always looking for something to drum along to/learn.  I'll give them a listen 👍

I understand why you like the Foos now , two great drummers 

[boratsbrother]

48 minutes ago, Thiago97 said:

It seems you just rinse and repeat this for every signing we make. You seem to always find a negative issue, either the money paid, the player not being good enough or not being enough of a game changer. Yet you never mention players you would like, then question it as pointless discussion when others do.

You wanted Tuchel out and you wanted Potter in. You got what you wanted, try and enjoy it more with a semi positive post, once in a while. 

We have spent over half a billion pounds in one season and have not spent a penny of it on the 3 types of players we most urgently need - a 20 + goal a season CF. A defensive midfielder and a creative, goal scoring midfielder. We've spent a British  record fee on a type of player who is basically an upgrade on the type of player that we badly needed to get rid of, which was a midfielder who was not great at either end of the pitch. I've been consistent with my views on the type of player we need to buy.

[thevelourfog]

15 minutes ago, Ham said:

If you're going to besmirch the Foo Fighters then I believe we're about to have our first falling out 🤘

I actually burst out laughing at the Bournemouth game when I saw they'd replaced the Park Life pre-match VT with the Foo Fighters. Felt very unnecessarily new American owners. Guess Todd isn't much of a Brit pop guy.

[boratsbrother]

17 minutes ago, Mark Kelly said:

I've got their greatest hits , which is OK , but they are feted as amazing which I think means they're overrated. There's two or three bangers but the rest is much of a muchness. I am honestly no barometer of musical taste to be frank , my Mrs has banned me from the in car music department!

I saw them live on tv some years ago (earth aid, or something  like that) and they kicked up a nice big noise and got the crowd really into it, but i have to say their music is extremely samey after a couple of songs.

Edited February 4, 2023 by boratsbrother

[Mark Kelly]

2 minutes ago, thevelourfog said:

I actually burst out laughing at the Bournemouth game when I saw they'd replaced the Park Life pre-match VT with the Foo Fighters. Felt very unnecessarily new American owners. Guess Todd isn't much of a Brit pop guy.

Has TB actually seen us win left or is he still a pariah?

[martin1905]

26 minutes ago, Mark Kelly said:

So if Potter is absolutely clueless how does it explain the very easy on the eye football Brighton were playing under him particularly when we are still playing the same turgid football we were seeing in the last few months of Tuchel? 

Not looking for a row just genuinely interested what the answer is because everyone was saying how good Potters Brighton were despite their relatively unknown players.

I think his Brighton team was a bit of a myth, I mean they didn't score goals, averaged one a game, they finished 9th on 51 points , 3 points above 12th. Interesting 51 points in any other season would have got them around 12th.

They were an average mid table side that were fairly pretty on the eye without being very good going at actually winning football games, 12 wins that season which is less than the teams that finished 10th, 11th, 13th and 14th and 8th lowest in the league.

Also they were the 4th lowest scoring team in the league.

It's no wonder we are seeing what we are seeing.

 

 

[Mark Kelly]

1 minute ago, martin1905 said:

I think his Brighton team was a bit of a myth, I mean they didn't score goals, averaged one a game, they finished 9th on 51 points , 3 points above 12th. Interesting 51 points in any other season would have got them around 12th.

They were an average mid table side that were fairly pretty on the eye without being very good going at actually winning football games, 12 wins that season which is less than the teams that finished 10th, 11th, 13th and 14th and 8th lowest in the league.

Also they were the 4th lowest scoring team in the league.

It's no wonder we are seeing what we are seeing.

 

 

Ok thanks Martin

[Thiago97]

10 minutes ago, boratsbrother said:

We have spent over half a billion pounds in one season and have not spent a penny of it on the 3 types of players we most urgently need - a 20 + goal a season CF. A defensive midfielder and a creative, goal scoring midfielder. We've spent a British  record fee on a type of player who is basically an upgrade on the type of player that we badly needed to get rid of, which was a midfielder who was not great at either end of the pitch. I've been consistent with my views on the type of player we need to buy.

The only consistency is the constant negativity. 

[thevelourfog]

39 minutes ago, martin1905 said:

Indeed, he is just one of many examples too. 

I'm sure Everton will be a much better side today after only a week under the new manager. 

Just beaten Arsenal. And looked good and solid for it, too.

It's a big problem when you look worse for changing coach/manager. Not looking instantly better, fine. Understandable. But worse should not be happening.

[Mark Kelly]

2 minutes ago, thevelourfog said:

Just beaten Arsenal. And looked good and solid for it, too.

It's a big problem when you look worse for changing coach/manager. Not looking instantly better, fine. Understandable. But worse should not be happening.

Did you not think that last night we tried to move the ball vertically and with more purpose than previously? 

We certainly didn't look worse for changing the manager at the beginning of Potters tenure , didn't we collectively worry we'd get knocked out of the Champions league at one time?  Potter came in and we sailed through from memory.  Maybe that was the famed "new manager bounce" and now we're back to normal? 

The loss of James and Chilwell pulled the rug from under us as well.

I'm still not convinced by Potter at all but I can definitely see some small signs of recovery.

[martin1905]

7 minutes ago, thevelourfog said:

Just beaten Arsenal. And looked good and solid for it, too.

Ah, bugger, I thought it was the 17:30 game, was look forward to it

7 minutes ago, thevelourfog said:

It's a big problem when you look worse for changing coach/manager. Not looking instantly better, fine. Understandable. But worse should not be happening.

This just hits the nail firmly on the head.

To go so far backwards, in such a short space of time, with all the excuses in the world, means you made a massive mistake. The most worrying thing is that we are worse in every single aspect, from individual performances to every single aspect of the game of football.

Not seeing immediate improvement is one thing but seeing a huge down turn in literally everything is completely and utterly unacceptable.