Mason Mount

[boratsbrother]

4 hours ago, JaneB said:

Those three can go.  Mason is different level.  How have things got this far?  I blame GP for not valuing him and building the team around him 😡

I want Mount to stay at the club but in all honesty I don't think he's the kind of outstanding player a manager could build a team around.

Also think we've missed a trick in not trying Chalobah as a defensive midfielder. Given time I think he could have thrived in that position.

[xceleryx]

7 hours ago, JaneB said:

Those three can go.  Mason is different level.  How have things got this far?  I blame GP for not valuing him and building the team around him 😡

They've gotten this far because Mount himself has refused terms offered and therefore no agreement has been had. Something to have been rumoured as a problem going back to the back end of the RA era where he reportedly turned down a new deal then.

From what's come out the hold up seems to be both the length of the contract offered and the wages.

Mount doesn't want to sign a 6 or so year deal that'll take him into his 30's, as that prevents him from that "last big contract" players seek at the back end of their 20's. 

Wage wise Mount has rumoured to have been offered something similar to Reece James, a contract that carries a lower base wage but provides additional earning power through incentive bonuses that can be triggered. All of which aligns with the general direction the club has taken with how they wish to control wage expenditure moving forward. 

You can't really "blame" anyone here. Mount naturally wants the best deal he can possibly get, the club want to find the best deal for them that falls within their budgets, and this is the result of that. 

As for blaming Potter, that's disingenuous when this was a problem before he arrived for one. Secondly, Mount has also logged the 4th most minutes played in the squad this season. 

[xceleryx]

3 hours ago, boratsbrother said:

I want Mount to stay at the club but in all honesty I don't think he's the kind of outstanding player a manager could build a team around.

Also think we've missed a trick in not trying Chalobah as a defensive midfielder. Given time I think he could have thrived in that position.

Agree with you here about Mount. He's good player, and I'd like him to remain here moving forward for many years to come, however he's not in that upper bracket of players that you centre a team around either, 

Re Chalobah - I mentioned similar a while back also, particularly after selling Jorginho. If we wanted to play a midfield three then he would've been worth a try having played their in France. I don't think he'd have been perfect, or that he'd be a long term option there, but considering our other options it would've been worth a shot. 

[JaneB]

15 hours ago, boratsbrother said:

I want Mount to stay at the club but in all honesty I don't think he's the kind of outstanding player a manager could build a team around.

Also think we've missed a trick in not trying Chalobah as a defensive midfielder. Given time I think he could have thrived in that position.

He was exactly that not so long ago.

12 hours ago, xceleryx said:

They've gotten this far because Mount himself has refused terms offered and therefore no agreement has been had. Something to have been rumoured as a problem going back to the back end of the RA era where he reportedly turned down a new deal then.

From what's come out the hold up seems to be both the length of the contract offered and the wages.

Mount doesn't want to sign a 6 or so year deal that'll take him into his 30's, as that prevents him from that "last big contract" players seek at the back end of their 20's. 

Wage wise Mount has rumoured to have been offered something similar to Reece James, a contract that carries a lower base wage but provides additional earning power through incentive bonuses that can be triggered. All of which aligns with the general direction the club has taken with how they wish to control wage expenditure moving forward. 

You can't really "blame" anyone here. Mount naturally wants the best deal he can possibly get, the club want to find the best deal for them that falls within their budgets, and this is the result of that. 

As for blaming Potter, that's disingenuous when this was a problem before he arrived for one. Secondly, Mount has also logged the 4th most minutes played in the squad this season. 

He's not playing him right or making the most of his qualities.  I don't think he really fancies him or cares.

[chara]

1 hour ago, JaneB said:

He was exactly that not so long ago.

He's not playing him right or making the most of his qualities.  I don't think he really fancies him or cares.

Jane I think maybe you have hit the nail on the head....we are a stubborn bunch on here and sometimes do not look at the right reasons but I for one am beginning to think maybe our confusion at the GP approach is caused less by a questioning of his coaching approach and perhaps a slow realisation that it's just another job and bottom line is take home pay,.

The much despised Tubby did seem to have a pride in his job performance as did all the less popular coaches but GP seems to lack that real killer ambition...not well put but you got me thinking Jane (a dangerous thing!)

[Blue Moon]

Agree with that - I loathed Tubby as much as the next man (couldn't read Thomas the Tank Engine to my kids for months ...) but by the end, I felt almost guilty when I sang about him not caring about the club. H may not have had Chelsea in his heart, but we did improve under his management ...

[chara]

1 hour ago, Blue Moon said:

Agree with that - I loathed Tubby as much as the next man (couldn't read Thomas the Tank Engine to my ki ds for months ...) but by the end, I felt almost guilty when I sang about him not caring about the club. H may not have had Chelsea in his heart, but we did improve under his management ...

It's that apparent lack of ambition or killer instinct....a pride in one's trade as it were.

I'll not forget how Tubby tried to marginalise SFL and JT but he did do his best to do a decent job.

Our loathing had little to do with his job performance whereas our "confusion" with GP has everything to do with his job performance.

[JaneB]

5 hours ago, chara said:

Jane I think maybe you have hit the nail on the head....we are a stubborn bunch on here and sometimes do not look at the right reasons but I for one am beginning to think maybe our confusion at the GP approach is caused less by a questioning of his coaching approach and perhaps a slow realisation that it's just another job and bottom line is take home pay,.

The much despised Tubby did seem to have a pride in his job performance as did all the less popular coaches but GP seems to lack that real killer ambition...not well put but you got me thinking Jane (a dangerous thing!)

The wrong nail I think.  I didn't mean GP doesn't care about the job, just that he doesn't particularly care enough about MM to include him in his future plans.

 And just to add, I think GP is a decent man and I'm not trying to make it personal.

Anyway, let's see what happens tomorrow.....

[chara]

30 minutes ago, JaneB said:

The wrong nail I think.  I didn't mean GP doesn't care about the job, just that he doesn't particularly care enough about MM to include him in his future plans.

 And just to add, I think GP is a decent man and I'm not trying to make it personal.

Anyway, let's see what happens tomorrow.....

I understood what you were saying..it just led me a step further...I cannot understand the lack of "thrust" in his approach and whilst I think he is a decent guy I can feel no connection to him in a Chelsea sense or a real Chelsea connection from him.

As a modest keeper I taught myself to. as best I could, remain  self contained and not react to a conceded goal despite whatever dismay I might be feeling...that is different from accepting as far as I can see ,upsets with a shrug and conciliatory remarks about the opposition.

Apologies for being on the wrong topic page but as ever freewheeling debate is exactly that and not an exact science!

Always good to read your take on a situation.

[kev61]

10 hours ago, JaneB said:

He was exactly that not so long ago.

He's not playing him right or making the most of his qualities.  I don't think he really fancies him or cares.

Exactly so Jane.Mount is not just another player imo.He has the potential to be an all time great.

The 'rumour' is he could go for a fee of 70m.'He doesn't fit into the 'system' some will say.

What effing system? and by whom?

If liverpool or any other top club can get him for 70m it is a steal imo.

[Michael Tucker]

As far as I can see, MM hasn't said anything about wanting to leave, or being unhappy at Chelsea. Potter hasn't said anything that would suggest that he doesn't rate/want to keep MM. This is simply a media blow up on a slow news day.

Look, I don't  claim to know what's going on with any certainty. But surely, before condemning Potter and the club, shouldn't we wait and see what's actually happening?

[chara]

@Michael Tucker

Absolutely MT...although there is "no smoke "etc" it is all the usual speculation from a "jobsworth" media establishment. Bayern references as soon as TT went there,

Seems to be some MM v club conflict that could be anything from a mild disagreement or negotiating tactics to verge of a split.

 

[Michael Tucker]

 

5 minutes ago, chara said:Seems to be some MM v club conflict that could be anything from a mild disagreement or negotiating tactics to verge of a split.

 

6 minutes ago, chara said:

 

Seems to be some MM v club conflict that could be anything from a mild disagreement or negotiating tactics to verge of a split.

 

 

Or, nothing but the usual media beat-up on a slow news day!

[kev61]

36 minutes ago, Michael Tucker said:

As far as I can see, MM hasn't said anything about wanting to leave, or being unhappy at Chelsea. Potter hasn't said anything that would suggest that he doesn't rate/want to keep MM. This is simply a media blow up on a slow news day.

Look, I don't  claim to know what's going on with any certainty. But surely, before condemning Potter and the club, shouldn't we wait and see what's actually happening?

I don't think anyone is accusing Potter of the Mount situation Michael.

Tuchel was getting it wrong with Mount imo.

I said before,Mount is an intelligent young man that knows he worth.

He is doing what is best for HIM.If a coach can't see his potential in a position he thinks he is suited to why should he stick around?

Football is a money merry go round - every man for himself.

I have no problem with Mount moving on except I think it will be a bad thing for us..

[Michael Tucker]

4 hours ago, kev61 said:

He is doing what is best for HIM.

My point mate, is that we don't know what he's doing. And neither does the media.

He's been out injured for the past 4 Chelsea games, and the past 2 England games. I'm just thankful that he's back now - the rest will take care of itself.

[xceleryx]

20 hours ago, JaneB said:

He's not playing him right or making the most of his qualities.  I don't think he really fancies him or cares.

I just can't buy into this rational I'm afraid. 

Mount's been poor since the back end of Tuchel's reign, so one can't really say Potter alone is reason for his underperforming ways.  

Mount's also largely played the same attacking midfield position he's held under previous managers, with Potter not exactly asking him to do anything outlandishly different. 

And by all accounts the players like Potter and speak well of him. If there was an issue here I doubt Mount would be our 4th highest minute getter of all players, 3rd highest if you ignore Kepa. This includes 20 starts, which is only bettered by Havertz. 

Everything right now points to contract terms simply not aligning.

[ROTG]

15 minutes ago, xceleryx said:

Mount's been poor since the back end of Tuchel's reign, so one can't really say Potter alone is reason for his underperforming ways.

That more to do with the number of minutes he has played since being introduced by SFL.

It's going to be interesting to see how you defend Enzo next season when he falls off a cliff for being overplayed. "IMO he is already looking slightly knackered"

BTW - who in the midfield department this season before Enzo / Felix arrival was playing consistently better than Mount?

[RDCW]

3 hours ago, xceleryx said:

I just can't buy into this rational I'm afraid. 

Mount's been poor since the back end of Tuchel's reign, so one can't really say Potter alone is reason for his underperforming ways.  

Mount's also largely played the same attacking midfield position he's held under previous managers, with Potter not exactly asking him to do anything outlandishly different. 

And by all accounts the players like Potter and speak well of him. If there was an issue here I doubt Mount would be our 4th highest minute getter of all players, 3rd highest if you ignore Kepa. This includes 20 starts, which is only bettered by Havertz. 

Everything right now points to contract terms simply not aligning.

I'm not buying the narrative that Mount's form has been that poor. His finishing definitely needs to improve, but the work he does for the team (obviously having been asked to do so) has been excellent. He reads the game well, is aggressive in the challenge, has great movement and can pick a pass. He is playing in a disjointed, under-coached midfield and his contributions have been diminished by being forced to play alongside second rate contributors like Ziyech, Pulisic, Jorghino and a totally absent No 9.

Obviously we were spoilt when it comes to a goal scoring No 8 by the greatest ever exponent of the art, but Mount has the potential to be a better all round 8 and we should be building the team around him in my opinion.

[RDCW]

3 minutes ago, RDCW said:

I'm not buying the narrative that Mount's form has been that poor. His finishing definitely needs to improve, but the work he does for the team (obviously having been asked to do so) has been excellent. He reads the game well, is aggressive in the challenge, has great movement and can pick a pass. He is playing in a disjointed, under-coached midfield and his contributions have been diminished by being forced to play alongside second rate contributors like Ziyech, Pulisic, Jorghino and a totally absent No 9.

Obviously we were spoilt when it comes to a goal scoring No 8 by the greatest ever exponent of the art, but Mount has the potential to be a better all round 8 and we should be building the team around him in my opinion.

And if he was such an underperformer for Tuchel in the end, why did he continue to be picked by TT as his key man.....and why are Bayern now looking to buy him (IF rumours are to be believed).

Edited April 1, 2023 by RDCW

[Holymoly]

I'm hoping a change in manager may be the encouragement Mount needs in order to sign a contract extension.  Hopefully he will put off any final decision to leave until he sees which way the wind blows with Potter's replacement.

[JaneB]

#Mount in advanced talks to join Liverpool#

Worst, unbelievably awful news ever.  

What is he thinking?  What are Chelsea thinking?

This cannot be.

Mason IS Chelsea.

[Mark Kelly]

1 minute ago, JaneB said:

#Mount in advanced talks to join Liverpool#

Worst, unbelievably awful news ever.  

What is he thinking?  What are Chelsea thinking?

This cannot be.

Mason IS Chelsea.

It's more Likely Liverpool doing the running , however if he goes there knowing how we all feel about them then he is dead to me , still I suppose the lure of instantly becoming  England's best player instead of the dope holding them back is too strong . 

[Bob Singleton]

18 minutes ago, JaneB said:

#Mount in advanced talks to join Liverpool#

Worst, unbelievably awful news ever.  

What is he thinking?  What are Chelsea thinking?

This cannot be.

Mason IS Chelsea.

Liverpool obviously think he's more attainable than Bellingham (who has many of Europe's top clubs chasing him), and won't cost as much. Rumours are that they think they could get both Mount and Gallagher for about the same as just Bellingham, and they would, together, go a long way to the midfield rebuild Liverpool need.

[xceleryx]

I'm reaching a point where I don't really care what Mount does moving forward. He's dragged this whole contract situation out for years now - be it due to money, contract length, wanting to play in midfield, or whatever else. 

Something is clearly up from Mount's end when we've been able to extend both RJ and now Chilwell's contracts with relative ease. 

 

[Mark Kelly]

Just now, xceleryx said:

I'm reaching a point where I don't really care what Mount does moving forward. He's dragged this whole contract situation out for years now - be it due to money, contract length, wanting to play in midfield, or whatever else. 

Something is clearly up from Mount's end when we've been able to extend both RJ and now Chilwell's contracts with relative ease. 

 

Yep , I can't help feeling he's being badly advised .