Transfer Talk Topic

[xceleryx]

16 hours ago, Chelsea_Matt said:

I see it differently. Highly intelligent tacticians who would organise, galvanise and coach the side. I take your points but no one is perfect. 

IMO I just don’t want the latest shiny new toy 🧸 - it’s been a disaster every time. AVB, Frank and Potter. 😬🙈 🥬 <— closest emoji to celery 🤣

Agree, no one is perfect. 

There's a fine line between being progressive with hiring the stand out coaching talent that currently presents, and getting caught in the loop of hiring proven experience that are also somewhat stuck in their ways. 

As I've already said, I think Poch will remain here and we'll move him on at the end of his contract should we see no improvement being made*.

* - Progress being circumstantial to the availability of certain players and what our squad for next season looks like. Wouldn't expect vast improvement from a team riddled with injuries to key players for example.

[My Blood Is Blue]

7 hours ago, xceleryx said:

Tuchel I could somewhat see coming back and it being beneficial in some degree. Someone like Mourinho though, who I've seen plenty of in recent years with his time at Roma, would be an absolute mistake and a time bomb just waiting to explode. Even if you cast aside his volatile nature, his football is heinous and that's been highlighted by the new life that De Rossi has breathed into Roma since taking over. I get the sense it's more about the romanticism of a third spell opposed to acknowledging the manager he is today. 

The thing with Poch is that no one has claimed him to be "the man". He's an appointment for where we are now and what we're needing with a younger group, and I think that's been partially vindicated through his man management and ability to keep the moral within the group pretty steady despite the up and down nature of performances. He has an expiration date here, one can certainly argue if that's at seasons end or at the completion of his contract, but getting rid of him to appoint a volatile replacement that's going to clash and ruffle feathers has to potential to make thing far worse.

Whoever we appoint next has to be afforded time to build something, though either previous supporting, or by having the qualities that we want to progress forward with. We don't need that end game manager as of yet, we need someone who can foster a winning culture but also nurture and trust young players through their up's and down's. 

Any desire from myself to see Jose come back, is less about the brand of football he’d get us playing and more about having someone come in to install a winning mentality into these players and back into the club. The club seems to have completely lost its winning mentality after the new owners stripped everything linked to the Roman era. If Jose can help bring some of that back, I’d be delighted.

If Tuchel is also available and willing to come back, I would have him above Jose in a heartbeat, Tuchel has the winning mentality but also has a better understanding of the modern game and modern day players.

[RDCW]

4 hours ago, My Blood Is Blue said:

Any desire from myself to see Jose come back, is less about the brand of football he’d get us playing and more about having someone come in to install a winning mentality into these players and back into the club. The club seems to have completely lost its winning mentality after the new owners stripped everything linked to the Roman era. If Jose can help bring some of that back, I’d be delighted.

If Tuchel is also available and willing to come back, I would have him above Jose in a heartbeat, Tuchel has the winning mentality but also has a better understanding of the modern game and modern day players.

I've mostly kept my countenance over TT, but my opinion is that he has been somewhat overrated by Chelsea fans. I think he underperformed here, notwithstanding the obvious high point of the Champions League win. My recollection is of frustrating inconsistency and a decline (in the end) in morale and effectiveness, humiliating home defeats by Wolves, Bournemouth, Brentford etc  and a sense that he had somewhat lost the squad. The backdrop is of course complicated by the environment of administrative change and the broader context of sanctions and the pandemic, but I can't think of TT as being in the same class as Mourinho in his prime, Pep, Klopp or Allardyce (just kidding 😉). 

I'm not sure whom I would have as manager, but I wouldn't take back TT, whereas I agree with you that Mourinho would have a galvanising effect on the mentality of the club (assuming the hierarchy could muster the humility to learn the lessons he can teach) and could therefore be a viable option. Conte and Ancellotti are definitely no with this squad. Ideally what we want is nouveau Mourinho - someone manifestly passionate, inspiring and successful but looking to move on up to the Premier League and with the personality to redirect the club strategy and instil some genuine pride in the shirt.

[Blue Kratos]

8 hours ago, RDCW said:

I've mostly kept my countenance over TT, but my opinion is that he has been somewhat overrated by Chelsea fans. I think he underperformed here, notwithstanding the obvious high point of the Champions League win. My recollection is of frustrating inconsistency and a decline (in the end) in morale and effectiveness, humiliating home defeats by Wolves, Bournemouth, Brentford etc  and a sense that he had somewhat lost the squad. The backdrop is of course complicated by the environment of administrative change and the broader context of sanctions and the pandemic, but I can't think of TT as being in the same class as Mourinho in his prime, Pep, Klopp or Allardyce (just kidding 😉). 

I'm not sure whom I would have as manager, but I wouldn't take back TT, whereas I agree with you that Mourinho would have a galvanising effect on the mentality of the club (assuming the hierarchy could muster the humility to learn the lessons he can teach) and could therefore be a viable option. Conte and Ancellotti are definitely no with this squad. Ideally what we want is nouveau Mourinho - someone manifestly passionate, inspiring and successful but looking to move on up to the Premier League and with the personality to redirect the club strategy and instil some genuine pride in the shirt.

I get what you're saying about TT.

 

There were some frustrating results and performances and at the end it just went to pot but despite that TT got us to 4 finals (3 domestic 1 UCL) and 2 of them we lost on pens but all 3 thanks to VAR but that's another conversation.

We haven't really come anyway near to challenging for the league since 2017 but I feel in TT's first full season before Lukaku gate and injuries we were in that conversation and it was the first time in a long time I actually believed we could challenge but you know the rest.

Fast forward on and the British government stole our club and we were forced to be sold in a very short space in time. So in the space of a few months we were in one ownership we'd know for nearly 2 decades and thrusted straight into an unknown.

There were also TT's personal issues with his divorce and apparent behaviour.

My late Dad always said to me that you should never go back but judging by what I've witnessed the last 18 months I'd rather be mentioned briefly in a conversation than be forgotten completely.

Edited March 10 by Blue Kratos

[xceleryx]

18 hours ago, My Blood Is Blue said:

Any desire from myself to see Jose come back, is less about the brand of football he’d get us playing and more about having someone come in to install a winning mentality into these players and back into the club. The club seems to have completely lost its winning mentality after the new owners stripped everything linked to the Roman era. If Jose can help bring some of that back, I’d be delighted.

If Tuchel is also available and willing to come back, I would have him above Jose in a heartbeat, Tuchel has the winning mentality but also has a better understanding of the modern game and modern day players.

Do you really think Mourinho would instil that though within a young group? He couldn't do it at either Man Utd or Spurs prior, and his success at Roma requires context with respects to the competition they faced. It also came at the cost of sacrificing the league, then underperformed with the squad he had prior to being sacked earlier this season. For me the concept of Jose sounds better in theory than practise, once you evaluate the wider picture. And given how people complain about the football we've played under Tuchel, Potter and now Poch in recent years, it would be a heck of a lot more painful to watch under Mourinho and not take long for criticism to arise. 

Don't get me wrong I like both managers but neither are really the way forward IMO. 

[kev61]

6 hours ago, Blue Kratos said:

I get what you're saying about TT.

 

There were some frustrating results and performances and at the end it just went to pot but despite that TT got us to 4 finals (3 domestic 1 UCL) and 2 of them we lost on pens but all 3 thanks to VAR but that's another conversation.

We haven't really come anyway near to challenging for the league since 2017 but I feel in TT's first full season before Lukaku gate and injuries we were in that conversation and it was the first time in a long time I actually believed we could challenge but you know the rest.

Fast forward on and the British government stole our club and we were forced to be sold in a very short space in time. So in the space of a few months we were in one ownership we'd know for nearly 2 decades and thrusted straight into an unknown.

There were also TT's personal issues with his divorce and apparent behaviour.

My late Dad always said to me that you should never go back but judging by what I've witnessed the last 18 months I'd rather be mentioned briefly in a conversation than be forgotten completely.

Tuchel was faced with disgruntled players who thought they deserved a place on the team.

We played the best football under him that I can remember.Todays players are so rich that they really couldn't care less.

I would like to see Tuchel back rather than Mourhino - having said that I don't see these players on eight years contracts  busting a gut for any manager.

[chiswickblue]

Lots of people hoping for an authoritarian regime, mostly as they seem to believe this is what the feckless younger generations need.

Shall we just bring back military service and send the players to boot camp?

Or acknowledge that thankfully that era is behind us and the players themselves aren't the issue. They aren't being led well, and the overall profile of the squad isn't conducive to premier league success.

[My Blood Is Blue]

7 hours ago, xceleryx said:

Do you really think Mourinho would instil that though within a young group? He couldn't do it at either Man Utd or Spurs prior, and his success at Roma requires context with respects to the competition they faced. It also came at the cost of sacrificing the league, then underperformed with the squad he had prior to being sacked earlier this season. For me the concept of Jose sounds better in theory than practise, once you evaluate the wider picture. And given how people complain about the football we've played under Tuchel, Potter and now Poch in recent years, it would be a heck of a lot more painful to watch under Mourinho and not take long for criticism to arise. 

Don't get me wrong I like both managers but neither are really the way forward IMO. 

I don't think Jose is the perfect answer, but in comparison to the current guy in charge who seems to have no backbone, I think Jose would at least bring back a winning mentality to the club, he wouldn't allow for standards to drop to the level they have (on and off the pitch), ultimately he wouldn't be a yes man.

I do take your point about how he would deal with this young group though and they probably are too fragile to cope with him, so maybe we need the modern version of Mourinho, but whoever it is, I want a winner not a yes man.

[Morgs]

I genuinely fear for Poch if (when?) we lose tonight. I think the fans are restless and he needs a big performance and a bit of consistency. I think Newcastle will have too much for us - hard press, pace on the counter, physicality, closing off the space and pinning back our wingbacks, then ruthlessly taking the chances they get, whereas we don't. 

The fans are going to fully turn on Poch if we get beat tonight I think. I also think Clearlake are going to be taking a lot of criticism from the fans in the next few weeks and months. We arent far off demonstrations in the street. It gets really ugly from there. 

[Morgs]

Anyone else read with mild incredulity the comments from our new CEO this morning? 

Apparently he's "not really a football fan" and sees the fans as "customers" and the football as a "product". 

Just what we need. More disconnect between the faithful and the feckless. Brilliant. 

Edited March 11 by Morgs

[Ham]

10 minutes ago, Morgs said:

Anyone else read with mild incredulity the comments from our new CEO this morning? 

Apparently he's "not really a football fan" and sees the fans as "customers" and the football as a "product". 

Just what we need. More disconnect between the faithful and the feckless. Brilliant. 

Of all the things to get bent up about. People are looking for reasons to be annoyed now. 

We didn't hire him to be a fan.  He's not part of the coaching team. 

We hired him to be a professional CEO and to expand the brand. 

 

[MickyDroy]

8 minutes ago, Ham said:

Of all the things to get bent up about. People are looking for reasons to be annoyed now. 

We didn't hire him to be a fan.  He's not part of the coaching team. 

We hired him to be a professional CEO and to expand the brand. 

 

But to say that in a meeting with club supporters was dumb. If he can't read the room better than that I have no faith he'll do any good work for the club.

[ROTG]

21 minutes ago, Ham said:

We hired him to be a professional CEO and to expand the brand. 

What is the sales pitch for a mid table PL team?

[Bison]

57 minutes ago, Morgs said:

Anyone else read with mild incredulity the comments from our new CEO this morning? 

Apparently he's "not really a football fan" and sees the fans as "customers" and the football as a "product". 

Just what we need. More disconnect between the faithful and the feckless. Brilliant. 

Think it'd be easier to accept their cold approach if the 'product' wasn't so badly managed. You can't be this incompetent and also speak this way. 

[Morgs]

43 minutes ago, Ham said:

Of all the things to get bent up about. People are looking for reasons to be annoyed now. 

We didn't hire him to be a fan.  He's not part of the coaching team. 

We hired him to be a professional CEO and to expand the brand. 

 

If he doesn't understand (or doesn't want to) the nuance between say, a marketing company or an events management firm and a football team in terms of the brand, the business, the PR, the financing model, the market and the marketing, then he making his own job more difficult. 

In a time where it has never felt more "them vs us" for the fans in their relationship with the club, this is an appointment that underlines that very starkly in my opinion. 

I'm not bent out of shape about it, I just think it is indicative of how Clearlake sees the club now and why the disconnect has never felt so yawning. 

[Morgs]

Predictions for tonight then, lads and lasses? 

I'm going for a 0-2 loss. Chelsea have the better chances, Newcastle take theirs, we don't. 

[Blue Moon]

7 minutes ago, Morgs said:

Predictions for tonight then, lads and lasses? 

I'm going for a 0-2 loss. Chelsea have the better chances, Newcastle take theirs, we don't. 

As this is the transfer thread, I presume you mean we sell Palmer and Gallagher to the Toon?

On the off-chance you don't, I'll see you. Chelsea to win 2:1. Ever the optimist (=bloody fool), me ....

[Blue Moon]

7 hours ago, Blue Moon said:

On the off-chance you don't, I'll see you. Chelsea to win 2:1. Ever the optimist (=bloody fool), me ....

Got the goal difference right! Great night out!

[Miguelito07]

Just watched the Barcelona v Napoli and Osimehn is being schooled by a 17yr old defender. He is definitely not worth the £120m quoted

[ROTG]

9 hours ago, Miguelito07 said:

Just watched the Barcelona v Napoli and Osimehn is being schooled by a 17yr old defender. He is definitely not worth the £120m quoted

If the rumours are to believed his options are,  PSG with European football etc Vs 8 year pension, lower wages and project chelsea

[Miguelito07]

1 hour ago, ROTG said:

If the rumours are to believed his options are,  PSG with European football etc Vs 8 year pension, lower wages and project chelsea

tough choice 😆

[Floyd25]

Sérgio Conceição makes me laugh, acted like a child after we beat them and now doing it again, blokes nearly 50 years old for heavens sake. 

[paulw66]

Alleged 20% sell on clause for Musiala, who is expected to be sold for 80m this summer. 

[ROTG]

52 minutes ago, paulw66 said:

Alleged 20% sell on clause for Musiala, who is expected to be sold for 80m this summer. 

The summer IMO could be one of the most interesting for a while, not only is there going to be a manager merry-go-round, there is also going to be interested to see who in the PL make big signings, this summer, when you take into account the PL rules and punishments they are giving to clubs.

Someone like Musiala, is probably valued a lot lower than £80m by PL clubs and it will be interesting to see if any match the valuation.

I also doubt we will witness a Caicedo type bidding war for a player again.

If we do get 20% sell on fee for Musiala well done to Marina & Co.

Edited March 13 by ROTG

[Morgs]

46 minutes ago, ROTG said:

The summer IMO could be one of the most interesting for a while, not only is there going to be a manager merry-go-round, there is also going to be interested to see who in the PL make big signings, this summer, when you take into account the PL rules and punishments they are giving to clubs.

Someone like Musiala, is probably valued a lot lower than £80m by PL clubs and it will be interesting to see if any match the valuation.

I also doubt we will witness a Caicedo type bidding war for a player again.

If we do get 20% sell on fee for Musiala well done to Marina & Co.

Agreed. We will be shedding a lot of the excess weight and bringing in some experience down the spine. 

Will be an experienced CB to replace Silva, and possibly Wes. 

Will be an experienced striker to replace Broja/Lukaku. 

Will be am experienced winger to replace Sterling and Madueke. 

Meanwhile we are shedding 7 or 8 players. A busy summer. But we saw in the Newcastle game that there is a suggestion of the basis of a half decent side there. Gusto, James, Colwill, Gallagher, Petrovic, Caicedo, Chukwuemeka, dare I say it Jackson and maybe Enzo as well. Nkunku and the aforementioned Wes Fofana to come back as well, there are some very good players there.