Transfer Talk Topic

[Bert19]

29 minutes ago, boratsbrother said:

How about chucking a couple of hundred million Villa's way for their keeper and Watkins?  They may not be absolute top draw but they would both be significant upgrades of the level we need. I'd rather we spent that kind of money on two upgrades than waste it on more squad fillers like we've done.

If Liverpool are really paying around £25m for Giorgi Mamardashvili then one feels like our Scouting team are not doing us justice if they keep shelling out marginally less regularly to keep signing pretty average goalies. 

The above mentioned Georgian would probably have solved all of our issues tbh

[Mark Kelly]

35 minutes ago, Bert19 said:

If Liverpool are really paying around £25m for Giorgi Mamardashvili then one feels like our Scouting team are not doing us justice if they keep shelling out marginally less regularly to keep signing pretty average goalies. 

The above mentioned Georgian would probably have solved all of our issues tbh

I think this has been on the cards for some while , so it may possibly be the case that he was off the list as he was already committed to going there?  ( Probably not though ) 

[Bert19]

Just now, Mark Kelly said:

I think this has been on the cards for some while , so it may possibly be the case that he was off the list as he was already committed to going there?  ( Probably not though ) 

I mean, we've been looking for a long-term Goalie since Clearlake took over (or even before) and they're obsessed with young talent ID so one might have thought he'd have been on their radar for quite a while surely? 

[Mark Kelly]

11 minutes ago, Bert19 said:

I mean, we've been looking for a long-term Goalie since Clearlake took over (or even before) and they're obsessed with young talent ID so one might have thought he'd have been on their radar for quite a while surely? 

You'd like to think , I do get the distinct impression that our plan is very much in the "jam tomorrow" mould though.

[Bison]

14 hours ago, Ham said:

Is this the same previous manager that was universally declared a talentless waster because he knew nothing about coaching players. 

Felix was rejected by several coaches as @ROTG said so Poch definitely wasn't alone.

No surprise the idiots were able to force Felix onto their stooge once the adult had left the room. 

He is a pointless player who should only play 15 minutes of a game that has already been won (as seen vs Wolves and his non-impact vs Palace).

Edited September 5 by Bison

[Blue Kratos]

2 hours ago, Bison said:

Felix was rejected by several coaches as @ROTG said so Poch definitely wasn't alone.

No surprise the idiots were able to force Felix onto their stooge once the adult had left the room. 

He is a pointless player who should only play 15 minutes of a game that has already been won (as seen vs Wolves and his non-impact vs Palace).

I think Nkunku is a better player too even though he hasn't set the place alight yet.

[xceleryx]

3 hours ago, Bert19 said:

If Liverpool are really paying around £25m for Giorgi Mamardashvili then one feels like our Scouting team are not doing us justice if they keep shelling out marginally less regularly to keep signing pretty average goalies. 

The above mentioned Georgian would probably have solved all of our issues tbh

Not particularly strong at ground level which is likely why we had no grand interest, he's not really a good fit for wanting to play like we do out of the back. Very strong shot stopper however, but one needs to be more than that.

[xceleryx]

4 hours ago, boratsbrother said:

How about chucking a couple of hundred million Villa's way for their keeper and Watkins?  They may not be absolute top draw but they would both be significant upgrades of the level we need. I'd rather we spent that kind of money on two upgrades than waste it on more squad fillers like we've done.

Unlikely for Villa to sell either unless some sort of massive overpay was to be had. If they were doing poorly it may be a different story, but with them doing well they'll want to keep two of their key players.

That aside, Waktins is 29 in December and has a contract until 2028. He's probably got 3-4 good seasons left in him should his legs not fade sooner. For the money Villa would demand there's probably not enough value to be had out of him from a playing perspective in relation to fee. Not even sure he's what we need either, I'd rather a more physical CF that can move defenders when we're up against teams that sit back.

Martinez just signed a new deal recently until 2029, so that probably rules him out of a move also. We should've looked at him when we opted for Sanchez. Would take him for anything around £30m mark, keeping in him he's 32 and probably at his peak for another 2-3 seasons. 

[Bison]

35 minutes ago, Blue Kratos said:

I think Nkunku is a better player too even though he hasn't set the place alight yet.

Agreed. He hasn't set the world alight but Nkunku is unequivocally a better final third footballer than Enzo. 

[Sleeping Dave]

49 minutes ago, xceleryx said:

Not particularly strong at ground level which is likely why we had no grand interest, he's not really a good fit for wanting to play like we do out of the back. Very strong shot stopper however, but one needs to be more than that.

Yep - being able to make saves is a highly overrated trait in goalkeepers. As long as they can pass the ball around a bit we're all over it. 

[boratsbrother]

23 minutes ago, Sleeping Dave said:

Yep - being able to make saves is a highly overrated trait in goalkeepers. As long as they can pass the ball around a bit we're all over it. 

How many goals are scored and games won by a keeper making  20 yard passes? How many goals are prevented and games won by a keeper making great saves a lesser keeper wouldn't have made?  

For me it's shot stopping first. Dealing with crosses second. Organising the defence third and then the passing of the keeper.

[Mark Kelly]

29 minutes ago, boratsbrother said:

How many goals are scored and games won by a keeper making  20 yard passes? How many goals are prevented and games won by a keeper making great saves a lesser keeper wouldn't have made?  

For me it's shot stopping first. Dealing with crosses second. Organising the defence third and then the passing of the keeper.

Spot on 

[Chelsea_Matt]

32 minutes ago, boratsbrother said:

How many goals are scored and games won by a keeper making  20 yard passes? How many goals are prevented and games won by a keeper making great saves a lesser keeper wouldn't have made?  

For me it's shot stopping first. Dealing with crosses second. Organising the defence third and then the passing of the keeper.

Exactly…! It’s like people excusing strikers not doing their primary job - scoring! - by saying stuff like, “oh he holds the ball up well” or “he brings other players in” etc. 

[Max Fowler]

39 minutes ago, boratsbrother said:

How many goals are scored and games won by a keeper making  20 yard passes? How many goals are prevented and games won by a keeper making great saves a lesser keeper wouldn't have made?  

For me it's shot stopping first. Dealing with crosses second. Organising the defence third and then the passing of the keeper.

Sorry bro, this is an old-fashioned worldview

[Max Fowler]

2 hours ago, Blue Kratos said:

I think Nkunku is a better player too even though he hasn't set the place alight yet.

  Nkunku is better than Felix but is incredibly injury prone and it’s destroying his career. Will be out for another 2 to 3 months this season mark my words. Again, we’ve planned the squad around a very injury prone player

[KingThistle]

2 minutes ago, Max Fowler said:

Sorry bro, this is an old-fashioned worldview

It's also why we have 3 keeper's who might as well be scarecrows. It is quite literally the stupidest change to football mentality to exclusively decide your number 1 between the sticks "if he is good with his feet".

[Sleeping Dave]

1 hour ago, boratsbrother said:

How many goals are scored and games won by a keeper making  20 yard passes? How many goals are prevented and games won by a keeper making great saves a lesser keeper wouldn't have made?  

For me it's shot stopping first. Dealing with crosses second. Organising the defence third and then the passing of the keeper.

Sorry, I think my sarcasm didn’t land properly. 

[Max Fowler]

1 hour ago, KingThistle said:

It's also why we have 3 keeper's who might as well be scarecrows. It is quite literally the stupidest change to football mentality to exclusively decide your number 1 between the sticks "if he is good with his feet".

Problem is I don't even think our keepers are particularly good with their feet. 

[xceleryx]

9 hours ago, Sleeping Dave said:

Yep - being able to make saves is a highly overrated trait in goalkeepers. As long as they can pass the ball around a bit we're all over it. 

Given the frequency in which many piss and moan about Sanchez's distribution , I'd say that being able to efficiently play out from the back and remain calm under pressure is just as highly valued. 

But since it's not, I look forward to not hearing a single peep moving forward whenever a GK fails to distribute the ball efficiently, or if they're ever caught in possession when pressured. Fair's fair, right? 

[Sleeping Dave]

5 hours ago, xceleryx said:

Given the frequency in which many piss and moan about Sanchez's distribution , I'd say that being able to efficiently play out from the back and remain calm under pressure is just as highly valued. 

But since it's not, I look forward to not hearing a single peep moving forward whenever a GK fails to distribute the ball efficiently, or if they're ever caught in possession when pressured. Fair's fair, right? 

I’ve never complained over Sanchez distribution. I’ve complained he’s not a very good goalkeeper. He’s prone to mistakes, has the odd worldie in him but in the end he’s not much more than average. 

You’re way too focused on us having a goalkeeper who is Jon Obi Mikel in possession but can’t see past the obvious - a goalkeepers primary job is to be the last defense to prevent goals. Not to make fancy passes in his own box. As we are on the subject of Sanchez, he quite often bottles that as well. I certainly don’t feel safe when he’s trying to be cute in his own box. 

[xceleryx]

Just now, Sleeping Dave said:

I’ve never complained over Sanchez distribution. I’ve complained he’s not a very good goalkeeper. He’s prone to mistakes, has the odd worldie in him but in the end he’s not much more than average. 

You’re way too focused on us having a goalkeeper who is Jon Obi Mikel in possession but can’t see past the obvious - a goalkeepers primary job is to be the last defense to prevent goals. Not to make fancy passes in his own box. As we are on the subject of Sanchez, he quite often bottles that as well. I certainly don’t feel safe when he’s trying to be cute in his own box. 

Nah, I'm really not. I've said we need someone who is capable at BOTH shot-stopping and playing on the ground, it's not that I value possession more but it's obviously an integral component to how we play - or want to play. And in the case of Mamardashvili, his ground game and on ball composure lags well behind his goalkeeping abilities. 

Sanchez is meh, at best. Really wouldn't object to seeing him replaced any time soon. I do wonder if we're waiting to see how Penders gets on over the year with his loan. If he excels, maybe we'll throw him into the first team squad and take a closer look to see if he's ready. 

[Bison]

28 minutes ago, Sleeping Dave said:

I’ve never complained over Sanchez distribution. I’ve complained he’s not a very good goalkeeper. He’s prone to mistakes, has the odd worldie in him but in the end he’s not much more than average. 

You’re way too focused on us having a goalkeeper who is Jon Obi Mikel in possession but can’t see past the obvious - a goalkeepers primary job is to be the last defense to prevent goals. Not to make fancy passes in his own box. As we are on the subject of Sanchez, he quite often bottles that as well. I certainly don’t feel safe when he’s trying to be cute in his own box. 

It's also worth noting that Sanchez was dropped at Brighton because De Zerbi said lower league career journeyman Jason Steele was better suited to playing out the back.

Sanchez was then effectively third choice after throwing his toys out the pram and refusing to sit on the bench. 

Now you're probably thinking that should have tanked his value...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[KingThistle]

2 hours ago, xceleryx said:

Nah, I'm really not. I've said we need someone who is capable at BOTH shot-stopping and playing on the ground, it's not that I value possession more but it's obviously an integral component to how we play - or want to play. And in the case of Mamardashvili, his ground game and on ball composure lags well behind his goalkeeping abilities. 

Sanchez is meh, at best. Really wouldn't object to seeing him replaced any time soon. I do wonder if we're waiting to see how Penders gets on over the year with his loan. If he excels, maybe we'll throw him into the first team squad and take a closer look to see if he's ready. 

All this focus on the goalkeeper being able to play out from the back, be good with his feet, distribute the ball well and not a mention that none of our defensive line can do it all that well either. 

It's become faddy - it's the "in" thing. I care not for it; I primarily would like my defenders to be able to defend and stick their foot through the ball sending into Row Z and for my goalie to be commanding in his box and save a lot more than he doesn't. 

"Playing out from the back" should involve the goalkeeper being able to pass ~10yrds to a defender who is the main instigator of possession-based football. All goalkeepers should be able to do that without the need to dub them specialists. If possession-based football really is an integral component to our "identity" then more work is needed on to enable Colwill, Fofana et al to hold onto and bring forward the football in a meaningful way - not the goalie.

[ChelseaJambo]

On 29/08/2024 at 15:33, Bob Singleton said:

No... none of the 'bomb squad' will be in either the PL or UEFA squads. That's a fact based on 'scientific' observations (ie what has been said and what has been done so far)  I am 100% NOT agreeing with you.

I introduced the PL squad (and UEFA squad) lists into the equation because it was clear that you were unaware that anyone NOT on those lists would be barred from playing until the next list was drawn up (and of course assuming that they would then be added to the list) after the next window closes.

It was clear from what you wrote that you believed any form of injury crisis would have the coach calling up players ineligible to play!

I'm not going to say any more on the subject. It's obvious that you live in your own little world, oblivious of the rules and regulations set out by the various governing bodies, and that furthermore you think Maresca is being, at best, disingenuous when he says the players in the 'bomb squad' have no future at the club, having "exiled" them, told them to find new clubs, and has acted like someone who genuinely has no interest in those players, having selected the 22 or so outfield players he does want to work with!

What do you make of the Euro squad? 

[Bert19]

21 hours ago, xceleryx said:

Not particularly strong at ground level which is likely why we had no grand interest, he's not really a good fit for wanting to play like we do out of the back. Very strong shot stopper however, but one needs to be more than that.

I'd argue that we need a strong shot stopper more than anything else having watched Sanchez play