Transfer Talk Topic

[ROTG]

5 hours ago, xceleryx said:

You're assuming we'd have Champions League football as if Tuchel was immune from finishing outside of the Top 4. 

The team would have finished in the top 6 and more likely top 4 under TT even without the January recruitment debacle from the TBSD. 

[Max Fowler]

5 hours ago, kev61 said:

The FACT is we were on the slide under Tuchel.

As Mark pointed out he could have turned around with the right support.

I feel some players were getting uppity and lacked desire under Tuchel and needed moved on.I have faith Tuchel knew who they were and would have got rid!.

Then Boehly and co  comes along with size 16 boots and wades in with both feet.

So yes, Boehly and Co have a lot to answer for, but probably unintentional.

Yeah - were on the slide from incredible overperformance to still doing way better than anything that came after. Liverpool have been „on the slide“ a couple of times under Klopp - difference is they still have him.

[Sleeping Dave]

Having thought about this for quite some time, I’ve landed in the realisation that we will need to make a ballsy reset in terms of the squad for 2023/24. The timing is perfect, and with some mitigating measures we might be able to keep some of the seniority in the squad. Assuming mainly a 4231:

 

GK: GK1, Arrizabalaga, Bettinelli

 

My preferred option would have been to sell Kepa and keep Mendy, or even sell them both and promote Slonina to GK2. But two factors makes that highly unlikely, 1 Kepa is unsellable and 2 Slonina needs games. Mendy will be easy to sell, he’s relatively cheap and isn’t on the highest wages. Kepa is both expensive in terms of a fee and is on a high salary. We will be stuck with him until his contract is up I’m afraid. Or at the very least when his book value is so low that we can unload him for £10m or so and he lowers his salary demands. For now I think the least bad option is to keep Kepa as our number two and get an experienced head in as our GK1 (30+). Reports that Pochettino would be happy with Kepa as his number one are comical. He’d be doing himself a huge disservice if that is the case come start of next season. 

 

RB: James, Malo 

LB: Chilwell, Maatsen 

CB: Fofana, Badiashile, Thiago Silva, Chalobah, Colwill

 

This is a no-brainier for me. Do everything we can to get Koulibaly off our books. Hopefully some crazy Saudi sheik wants to buy him or at the very least get him a loan with an option to buy. He should be nowhere near the squad next season. Azpi will leave, it really is time for that now. Cucurella is another one who will be impossible to sell. We will have to sort out a loan and just accept we’ll lose a lot of money on him. He shouldn’t be the reason why we sell Maatsen. Maatsen deserves a shot in the squad. If we don’t give him that then I’m not sure what we are doing with these championship loans. He’s on the back of a terrific season, he simply has to be given a squad place together with Colwill. I’d keep both Chalobah and Silva. Chalobah for his loyalty and versatility, Silva for his experience. Plus, having five CBs also gives us more flexibility to play both a back four and a back three/five.

 

CM: Enzo, DM, Gallagher, Santos, Hall

 

This is where we will see a lot of outgoings. Zakaria has already left. Loftus-Cheek I’d be happy to keep around, but that Achilles injury really was the final nail in the coffin. All he can manage now is to go somewhere else a level or so below us and have a pretty decent career. Badly mismanaged, but there you go. Kovacic is off and I’m happy for that. Jorginho already off and I’m elated that’s the case. Kante will also leave and that’s a positive all things considered. Still a player on his day, those days are just too few over a full season. Think Gallagher will suit Poch and Hall is a no-brainier for me. Can cover multiple positions (Chilwell is injury prone) and his best position is in midfield. Give the lad a chance to stake a serious claim. Santos is another one who hopefully will kick-on. Add a proper DM to the mix and although it’s an inexperienced group of players there’s a lot of potential there. 

 

CAM: Mount, Nkunku

WAM: Mudryk, Madueke, Sterling

 

I’d be very keen to sell Sterling but I’m trying to be realistic. He won’t leave this summer. But Ziyech and Pulisic have to and Hudson-Odoi is probably best sold. Awful loan to the bundesliga, he has no business being around the squad next season or most likely anytime in the future. Perhaps too much too soon for him and another one who suffered badly from his Achilles injury. I’d be doing everything possible to keep Mount and only add Nkunku. Five players for those three positions is still light, but with so few games next season maybe we can manage regardless (plus I think we should keep Havertz). 

 

S: S1, Havertz, Broja

 

This is where we have to go big. No way can Lukaku be expected to a job next season. Havertz isn’t good enough to be S1, but can be a rotational option at S2 and be rotated in the three behind the striker. Broja probably needs a loan, but maybe give him a chance to get to know Poch and then loan him out in January? 

 

Who to get as S1? Osimhen, Højlund, Vlahovic and possibly Martinez being four potential candidates. The noise about Jackson doesn’t feel right, he’d be a massive gamble at S1. 

 

Sell:

Mendy

Azpilicueta

Kovacic

Loftus-Cheek

Pulisic

Ziyech

Hudson-Odoi 

Aubameyang 

 

Loan:

Cucurella

Koulibaly 

Lukaku

D Fofana

 

Release:

Kante

Zakaria

Felix

 

Buy: 

GK1

DM1

Nkunku

S1

 

Starting XI:

 

                                GK1

James      Fofana     Badiashile    Chilwell

                       Enzo        DM1

                              Mount

     Madueke                                Sterling

                                  S1

Edited June 15, 2023 by Sleeping Dave

[Max Fowler]

11 hours ago, Mark Kelly said:

We managed to lose Rudiger one of the main reasons were not as good as we were under Tuchel, Christensen and came within a mm of losing Azpillecueta last year because the previous regime left it too late and then got caught out with the Ukraine business. 

I doubt you will find a single person on this forum who wants to lose Mount, he's universally loved but when he's determined to go and my theory is his nose was badly put out by the previous regime giving Lukaku the money Mount deserved himself there's not a lot Boehly can do about it. Every deal we have offered has been turned away. 

Mr Chelsea has his heart set on being Mr United. 

There’s more than a bit of denial going on here Mark. I read comment after comment saying good riddance to Mount and now no one wants to lose him? And no one is apologising for Boehly when excuse after excuse is being made for him.

9 hours ago, Holymoly said:

That "someone" was me but I went on to qualify that comment by pointing out that whoever had taken over was going to be met with the same issues, namely zero continuity and a very unbalanced squad ravaged by injuries. Everyone at the club needs to take their share of the travesty that was this season, but to lump it all at the door of the owners is naive in the extreme.

So what percentage do you blame the owners, Mr. Moly? 20%, like Mark?

[Max Fowler]

7 hours ago, McCreadie said:

He has made mistakes, but the idea he knows absolutely nothing about football is a construct of the gutter press that you have swallowed whole.

It’s not the gutter press. It’s common football knowledge and common football sense. Clearly he knows something about running sports teams, but football itself? Please. 

[ROTG]

9 minutes ago, Sleeping Dave said:

Starting XI:

 

                                GK1

James      Fofana     Badiashile    Chilwell

                       Enzo        DM1

                              Mount

     Madueke                                Sterling

                                  S1

Sorry but I doubt that team would beat any of the current top 6 home or away. Would also struggle with a mid week winter match at kenelworth road. 
 

no leadership, no steel in the team, house of cards come to mind. 

[Max Fowler]

5 hours ago, kev61 said:

The FACT is we were on the slide under Tuchel.

As Mark pointed out he could have turned around with the right support.

I feel some players were getting uppity and lacked desire under Tuchel and needed moved on.I have faith Tuchel knew who they were and would have got rid!.

Then Boehly and co  comes along with size 16 boots and wades in with both feet.

So yes, Boehly and Co have a lot to answer for, but probably unintentional.

Yes, we were on the slide from absolute overperformance to still miles better than anything that came since. Of course - when Tuchel was 6th we we were on the slide and he had lost his touch. When we finished 12th it’s the entire squad that needs replacing (great logic!)

[ROTG]

2 minutes ago, Max Fowler said:

It’s not the gutter press. It’s common football knowledge and common football sense. Clearly he knows something about running sports teams, but football itself? Please. 

Agree. 
Biggest mistake was not hiring a Peter Kenyon type to steady the ship, and help build TB dream. 

[Bison]

Seeing clips of Nicolas Jackson I am absolutely sold. Exactly the type of CF we're crying out for.

[chrisb]

8 minutes ago, Max Fowler said:

There’s more than a bit of denial going on here Mark. I read comment after comment saying good riddance to Mount and now no one wants to lose him? And no one is apologising for Boehly when excuse after excuse is being made for him.

So what percentage do you blame the owners, Mr. Moly? 20%, like Mark?

I don’t recall anyone saying “good riddance” to Mount. I think everyone on here wants Mount to stay but the problem is he doesn’t seem to want to. I think you’re reading into people saying that if he’s turning down contracts then get rid of him  now before we lose him for nothing at the end of the season. 
 

[Max Fowler]

5 hours ago, xceleryx said:

Yeah, but you're treating it as such. 

Mount started all but 3 PL games under Potter before injury ended his season. Despite this he still finished with the 8th most league minutes played and was only passed by a few because he missed 10 of the last 14 games. Similar stands for Kovacic who finished with the 6th most league minutes played this season, actually playing more than he did last season as a matter of fact. While virtually also being "managed" through at least part of the season due to his knee problem. The difference for either would've been marginal under Tuchel at best. 

You're assuming we'd have Champions League football as if Tuchel was immune from finishing outside of the Top 4. 

Is that so, have you spoken to both players personally to confirm this is their biggest sticking points? Of course not, you're merely projecting to create the narrative you seek.

I mean it’s common knowledge Kovacic absolutely adored Tuchel and vice versa. It’s impossible to imagine he would have wanted out if Tuchel stayed.

I admit Mount is more of a guess, but you’re failing to ask the questions of why our best players want to leave in the first place.

[Max Fowler]

12 minutes ago, chrisb said:

I don’t recall anyone saying “good riddance” to Mount. I think everyone on here wants Mount to stay but the problem is he doesn’t seem to want to. I think you’re reading into people saying that if he’s turning down contracts then get rid of him  now before we lose him for nothing at the end of the season. 
 

Fair enough, but the point remains about Boehly.

 

Come on Poch 

 

 

[Max Fowler]

 

 

[thevelourfog]

4 hours ago, kev61 said:

I will say again Mount has fallen down the pecking order.Do you expect him to stay because he supported Chelsea as a boy?

Think he grew up a Portsmouth fan tbf, definitely from that area and vaguely recall hearing him talk about going to Fratton Park.

Still take your point, mind.

49 minutes ago, Bison said:

Seeing clips of Nicolas Jackson I am absolutely sold. Exactly the type of CF we're crying out for.

Failed a medical at Bournemouth in January, apparently.

[Bison]

14 minutes ago, thevelourfog said:

Think he grew up a Portsmouth fan tbf, definitely from that area and vaguely recall hearing him talk about going to Fratton Park.

Still take your point, mind.

Failed a medical at Bournemouth in January, apparently.

Just had a look and it was a hamstring injury apparently so not the end of the world. 

Quote

 

Doctors determined he would be out of action until March 10 with a hamstring injury - not the expected February 10 return date.

That would leave the player just 12 games to help Bournemouth keep their place in the Premier League.

 

 

[xceleryx]

1 hour ago, ROTG said:

The team would have finished in the top 6 and more likely top 4 under TT even without the January recruitment debacle from the TBSD. 

Maybe, maybe not. Again, a top 4 spot was never a forgone conclusion like it was being portrayed. Granted, we'd have likely stood a better chance under Tuchel than we did Potter. 

[Ham]

5 hours ago, kev61 said:

It has Zilch to do with Mount!.If his "head is turned" then that is his perogative.

I will say again Mount has fallen down the pecking order.Do you expect him to stay because he supported Chelsea as a boy?

Did he fall down the pecking order or did he have a couple of injuries after the WC? 

A fit Mount would have gotten into that 11. 

[Bison]

Mount was in poor form long before the injuries. 

Always wonder why people just bat away poor form as nothing to worry about and perhaps not the beginning of a longer trend or even something worth keeping an eye on. We should know better than most. 

Edited June 15, 2023 by Bison

[Waspeze]

Personally the only one I really blame for our issues is HMG

Boehly came in and tried to make sweeping changes and recruitment which didn't work out but he meant well

Potter came in and tried to managed a team of 245 individuals..  didn't work and was out of his league but tried his best

etc

HMG tried to properly shaft us and blamed us for funding the war whereas we'd only ever taken money from RA not funded anything in Russia

just my opinion on it obviously!

[ROTG]

25 minutes ago, thevelourfog said:

Think he grew up a Portsmouth fan tbf,

 Correct. 

although Chelsea was the only club he wanted to play for. Therefore he fulfilled his dream, unfortunately being an international player and seeing the coming and goings at the club in the past twelve month’s is more than likely why he has take the route all top players of playing for an elite club and we naming trophies, which sadly is not the case at present with Chelsea under TB. 
 

Also, Poch has not building a top PL side since 2015 might also be a factor

[xceleryx]

1 hour ago, Sleeping Dave said:

Having thought about this for quite some time, I’ve landed in the realisation that we will need to make a ballsy reset in terms of the squad for 2023/24. The timing is perfect, and with some mitigating measures we might be able to keep some of the seniority in the squad. Assuming mainly a 4231:

<SNIPPED> 

Starting XI:

                                GK1

James      Fofana     Badiashile    Chilwell

                       Enzo        DM1

                              Mount

     Madueke                                Sterling

                                  S1

Couple things. 

• The midfield is awfully unbalanced outside of Enzo and a proposed first choice DM coming in. Gallagher and Hall cannot play as apart a of midfield pivot, they simply don't have the profile for said role. At a stretch maybe Gallagher pinch-hitting alongside a DM as a more aggressive option, but that's unlikely to happen as it'll mean dropping Enzo. Hall looked entirely lost at senior level in the one midfield appearance he had. Santos is a bit more suitable but a gamble in itself. Any reasonable injury to either Enzo or our DM and it's just about game over.
• Mount ain't gonna be here, in the rare chance he is I don't see why we'd start him over a far more dynamic and productive attacker in Nkunku who's ideal position is just off a main CF. Mount may give us more off the ball, but if we've got a proper pivot in place that'll secure things then having a more influential attacker makes far more sense. 

There's a couple other minor things but those are the big ones that stand out. Also baffles me wanting to keep Mendy over Kepa, when the former has two left feet and has showcased he ain't it.

[Ham]

5 minutes ago, Bison said:

Mount was in poor form long before the injuries. 

Always wonder why people just bat away poor form as nothing to worry about and perhaps not the beginning of a longer trend or even something worth keeping an eye on. We should know better than most. 

Yes but was his poor form the result of niggling injuries? He eventually had to have surgery on an ongoing issue in the abdominal area.  

In prior seasons he was the hardest working player on the pitch. This season he was a shadow of himself.

 

[Mark Kelly]

34 minutes ago, Bison said:

Just had a look and it was a hamstring injury apparently so not the end of the world. 

 

Hamstring? Welcome home. 

[xceleryx]

1 hour ago, Max Fowler said:

I mean it’s common knowledge Kovacic absolutely adored Tuchel and vice versa. It’s impossible to imagine he would have wanted out if Tuchel stayed.

I admit Mount is more of a guess, but you’re failing to ask the questions of why our best players want to leave in the first place.

But also not improbable either. Maybe the club makes the decision and opts not to offer Kovacic a new contract feeling that between his injuries and lack of protection the value was no longer there. You just don't know.

The general consensus are contractual issues being the underlying reason as to why. You'll have to ask Mount why he turned down an extension after winning the Champions League while Roman was still owner, or why neither a long or short term satisfied him more recently. You'll need to ask why Havertz doesn't want to reportedly extend either. We can't force players to extend their deals. And if they don't want to be here then the next course of action is to sell and recoup what we can, the alternative of letting them go for nothing is just straight up bad business in this day and age. 

[ShedMiddle]

1 hour ago, ROTG said:

Sorry but I doubt that team would beat any of the current top 6 home or away. Would also struggle with a mid week winter match at kenelworth road. 
 

no leadership, no steel in the team, house of cards come to mind. 

And there is no Nkunku who will be a nailed on starter. The more you look at it the more you realise we need a leader! In fact leaders! Enzo, and Colwill are looking our best bets as it stands.