east lower Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 14 minutes ago, Max Fowler said: It is in my opinion, partly that the people we have hired are not elite level football people, but also that the owners have set a culture of us being data driven almost at all costs and so our sporting directors are making decisions based on that culture and not daring to think for themselves. The sporting directors have never set foot on a professional football pitch and played at that level. Unless you are truly exceptional you won’t get by - Jose Mourinho a good example of that, but he did inherit talent and leader's. No one like that left at Chelsea, especially so when know-it-all (but in reality, know little) owners get rid of or let go those we did have. One came from account management at a retail company into football. Wigan, Derby, Hull City, Head of Performance Data at Man City, Monaco count as their CV’s. Over-promoted and overly relied on by owners who’ve never owned or ran any sort of football club prior to ours. The plan is flawed, the how to achieve it is flawed and the recruitment to support, an already flawed approach is of catastrophic proportions. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Fowler Posted April 2 Author Share Posted April 2 34 minutes ago, Mark Kelly said: Well , you may be right , who knows , personally I think most of the players are at the very least half-way decent and we should be seeing better performances from them than we are and I personally believe that's at least ninety percent (if I'm being kind) on the Spacehopper Again Mark - the owners have clearly stuck by Poch when he should have been sacked five times by now. You should be aiming pelters at the ownership for that because if he really is that bad, they are making a big mistake keeping him on and need to be held to account. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kelly Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 9 minutes ago, Max Fowler said: Again Mark - the owners have clearly stuck by Poch when he should have been sacked five times by now. You should be aiming pelters at the ownership for that because if he really is that bad, they are making a big mistake keeping him on and need to be held to account. The problem is that I'm a nobody , I'm not qualified to tell them what to do , we're here complaining that people who do this as a living aren't meeting our exacting requirements ! I don't agree with a lot of what they're doing but they're not as bad owners as they could be , at least they're trying to be good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Fowler Posted April 2 Author Share Posted April 2 2 minutes ago, Mark Kelly said: The problem is that I'm a nobody , I'm not qualified to tell them what to do , we're here complaining that people who do this as a living aren't meeting our exacting requirements ! I don't agree with a lot of what they're doing but they're not as bad owners as they could be , at least they're trying to be good. But why couldn't I say the same thing about your criticism of Poch? You have plenty to say about Poch but nothing to say about the owners. Better to be consistent and hold everyone to account for our failure 🙂 I'm sure Poch is "trying to be good" as well but ultimately he is failing. So are the owners. Let's be consistent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Mark Kelly Posted April 2 Popular Post Share Posted April 2 Just now, Max Fowler said: But why couldn't I say the same thing about your criticism of Poch? You have plenty to say about Poch but nothing to say about the owners. Better to be consistent and hold everyone to account for our failure 🙂 I'm sure Poch is "trying to be good" as well but ultimately he is failing. So are the owners. Let's be consistent. Ahh but ... the owners are trying to be good in respect of buying loads of players and investing in the side , that they have made mistakes is irrefutable . I don't think Poch is trying to be good , he's trying to appear to be good . And he isn't any good at all , I can clearly see that he isn't otherwise we'd have a group philosophy laid down by now , I'm not keen on Arteta but you could see what he was trying to achieve even though at times his side were found wanting . I have literally no idea what we are trying to do , none whatsoever . 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bones Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 Was Poch a great footballer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kelly Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 9 minutes ago, Bones said: Was Poch a great footballer? He played 20 times for Argentina and played for Espanyol Barcelonas "great" rivals so he can't have been awful although when Michael Owen scored that famous goal against the Argies I believe he was one of the Centre halves he jinked around whilst scoring. As a Centre half I'd expect him to be able to get the best out of our CB's but he appears wanting in that respect , well. in every respect in my opinion but you get my drift. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lump Of Celery Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 I saw a clip from this a couple of days ago that I found very interesting, and is very applicable to the discussion on data/metrics and how reliable it is Leaders Letter 185 - Free Metrics Masterclass From Jeff Bezos - Focus Business Blog 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROTG Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Lump Of Celery said: I saw a clip from this a couple of days ago that I found very interesting, and is very applicable to the discussion on data/metrics and how reliable it is Leaders Letter 185 - Free Metrics Masterclass From Jeff Bezos - Focus Business Blog Apart from data/metrics, I wonder if TBSD have to report KPI “key performance indicators” to the major stakeholders Edited April 2 by ROTG 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chara Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 7 hours ago, east lower said: Because we both must be neanderthals, it's data that means the most. The ball arrives here or there a greater percentage of the time, so that's where we put our better headers of the ball. Never mind matching people up, blocking runs - use the data, we're currently 4th in the league don't you know! 😉 Of course I agree but a little known skill....reading the game as it happens..rare of course but seems the rare player who can do that usually appears to be in the right place with the appropriate marking tactic,,I recall a long ago comment..."You may be taller than me but try jumping while I;m going for your balls" or such refined penalty area debate! Probably slightly less literate on the day but you get the point. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Fowler Posted April 2 Author Share Posted April 2 1 hour ago, ROTG said: Apart from data/metrics, I wonder if TBSD have to report KPI “key performance indicators” to the major stakeholders 100%. Data team will be reporting to the owners as well that our +XG 4th in the league is an extremely positive KPI that Poch can report to the fans. Corporate world mutual masturbation. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bones Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 Wacthed the whole interview - Jeff Bezos, wow! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bones Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 4 hours ago, Mark Kelly said: He played 20 times for Argentina and played for Espanyol Barcelonas "great" rivals so he can't have been awful although when Michael Owen scored that famous goal against the Argies I believe he was one of the Centre halves he jinked around whilst scoring. As a Centre half I'd expect him to be able to get the best out of our CB's but he appears wanting in that respect , well. in every respect in my opinion but you get my drift. Righto. But he was not elite like Pep, Alonso, Ancelotti, etc. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelsea_Matt Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 4 hours ago, Mark Kelly said: Ahh but ... the owners are trying to be good in respect of buying loads of players and investing in the side , that they have made mistakes is irrefutable . I don't think Poch is trying to be good , he's trying to appear to be good . And he isn't any good at all , I can clearly see that he isn't otherwise we'd have a group philosophy laid down by now , I'm not keen on Arteta but you could see what he was trying to achieve even though at times his side were found wanting . I have literally no idea what we are trying to do , none whatsoever . And the chap at Villa. He’s done so well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROTG Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 14 minutes ago, Chelsea_Matt said: And the chap at Villa. He’s done so well. He has, however he took over a squad which was underperforming due to the incompetence of Steve G “deja vu TT taking over from Frank”, rather than being given a bag of dolly mixtures put together by scouts. It would have been quite interesting to see how Poch and the squad at the time, would have performed had Poch replaced TT rather than the nobody coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROTG Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 (edited) 8 hours ago, xceleryx said: The only balanced argument to be had here from a generalisation point is that there's room for both data and more classic and conventional methods. If more classic and conventional methods are being used by the club, how did the club buy, punt and loan so many players in last summers transfer window, without any 1st team coaching staff being in place? Edited April 2 by ROTG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kelly Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 Just now, ROTG said: If more classic and conventional methods are being used by the club, how did the club buy, punt and loan so many players in the last summer transfer window, without any 1st team coaching staff being in place? Is this groundhog day? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ROTG Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Mark Kelly said: Is this groundhog day? You’ll probably have to wait until the end of the season and 1st July for the answer to that one. Edited April 2 by ROTG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
east lower Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/68691248 Wonderful job the old boys and our owners are doing………….for them! And, the results published are not for the year that includes Caicedo and Sanchez!! Great job chaps. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelsea_Matt Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 30 minutes ago, east lower said: https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/68691248 Wonderful job the old boys and our owners are doing………….for them! And, the results published are not for the year that includes Caicedo and Sanchez!! Great job chaps. Two shit players as well. Cucurella makes three. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelsea_Matt Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 2 hours ago, ROTG said: He has, however he took over a squad which was underperforming due to the incompetence of Steve G “deja vu TT taking over from Frank”, rather than being given a bag of dolly mixtures put together by scouts. It would have been quite interesting to see how Poch and the squad at the time, would have performed had Poch replaced TT rather than the nobody coach. Well we will never know though it’s an interesting question as you say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
east lower Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 1 minute ago, Chelsea_Matt said: Two shit players as well. Cucurella makes three. If someone regaled you the story, you’d say they’re making it up! Almost beyond belief, except that it’s happened/happening and we’ve still not learned the lesson - there’s another one coming after his ‘gardening-leave’. https://www.espn.co.uk/football/story/_/id/39561876/brighton-transfer-guru-joins-chelsea-amid-man-united-interest 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kelly Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 13 minutes ago, Chelsea_Matt said: Well we will never know though it’s an interesting question as you say. But. We can guess. LOL. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Fowler Posted April 2 Author Share Posted April 2 We're 12th again lads. 12th!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Fowler Posted April 2 Author Share Posted April 2 Facts. Our model does not require on the pitch success to be successful. I'm sorry - it just doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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